Science and IRF

This entry is part [part not set] of 19 in the series Zakir Naik Exposed

In this booklet, we explore the claims of the existing version of Quran translations in English available today as a book compatible with discoveries of modern science. Dr Zakir Naik (MBBS), a non-practicing medical undergraduate representing an organisation called IRF has attempted to explore mysteries of astrophysics through verses of Quran to claim that Quran is a book of so-called ‘signs’ that foretold revelations of modern science 1400 years ago. In this booklet, Indian Agnostic has scrutinized the medical undergraduate’s celebrated research in astrophysics presented in “THE QUR’AAN AND MODERN SCIENCE – COMPATIBLE OR INCOMPATIBLE?” which is a big hit among young students of Islamic science. You can download the original book from irf.net or a simple google search.
We welcome readers to freely download and distribute this review of Zakir Naik’s magnum opus. We also welcome readers to share their comments and have any further queries addressed through the comments section.
But more importantly, we request truth-seekers to reject falsehood. We understand that it would be difficult for Zakir Naik to do so because he seems to be trapped in an unholy nexus which believes in killing apostates and assigning hell for all non Muslims irrespective of their noble deeds. But for the lesser celebrities, may the light of truth eradicate all forms of superstitions and lies.
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Dr. Zakir Naik, in his book The Quran and Modern Science: Compatible or Incompatible? places certain Quranic verses as evidence before us, in support of his claim that Quran and modern science are indeed compatible (The booklet can be downloaded from IRF Site)
In this article, we will examine his arguments and evidences to ascertain if there is any truth to the claim or it is yet another propagandist stunt of Dr. Naik.
This article is heavily inspired from the RATIONAL arguments/facts published on Islam-critiquing sites like FaithFreedom.org , Islam-Watch.org, AnsweringMuslims.org etc. So many a thanks to all of them for making the job a cinch 🙂
[ *Extracts from Dr. Naik’s book appear under the title “Zakir Naik says”, in Italic, followed by our response. Emphasis, underline ours]
Zakir Naik says:
“In this booklet, I intend to give an objective analysis of the Muslim belief regarding the Divine origin of the Qur’aan, in the light of established scientific discoveries.”
Our response:
Tall claim Dr. Naik! Let’s see how objective, factual and rational you have been in this work of yours.
Zakir Naik says:
“There was a time, in the history of world civilization, when ‘miracles’, or what was perceived to be a miracle, took precedence over human reason and logic. But how do we define the term ‘miracle’? A miracle is anything that takes place out of the normal course of life and for which humankind has no Explanation”
“However, we must be careful before we accept something as a miracle. An article in ‘The Times of India’ Mumbai, in 1993 reported that ‘a saint’ by the name ‘Baba Pilot’ claimed to have stayed continuously submerged under water in a tank for three consecutive days and nights. However, when reporters wanted to examine the base of the tank of water where he claimed to have performed this ‘miraculous’ feat, he refused to let them do so. He argued by asking as to how one could examine the womb of a mother that gives birth to a child. The ‘Baba’ was hiding something. It was a gimmick simply to gain publicity. Surely, no modern man with even the slightest inkling towards rational thinking would accept such a ‘miracle’ “
Our response:
Point well taken Dr. Naik! So, how about subjecting a Quranic miracle to a similar scrutiny?

Let’s pick up a miracle claim of the Quran (Surah 57 Verse 1). This verse talks about the miracle of Prophet Muhammad splitting the moon in two!!!
(Source: http://www.usc.edu/schools/college/crcc/engagement/resources/texts/muslim/quran/054.qmt.html#054.001 )
YUSUFALI: The Hour (of Judgment) is nigh, and the moon is cleft asunder.
PICKTHAL: The hour drew nigh and the moon was rent in twain.
SHAKIR: The hour drew nigh and the moon did rend asunder
Now ask yourself: If staying submerged in water for 3 days was ‘baba pilots’ gimmick to gain publicity, then what should we call Muhammad’s claim of him splitting the moon in two? If a man can split moon into two parts from earth, what is the big deal if some other person remains submerged in water without oxygen? Which one is more preposterous of the two claims?

Borrowing Dr. Naik’s words: No modern man with even the slightest inkling towards rational thinking would accept any of these ‘miracles‘!
The way Dr. Naik discards baba pilot staying under water for 3 days as irrational, we expect him to apply the same rationale in discarding Muhammad’s miracle of splitting the moon in two. So Dr. Naik, when you get to read this, we expect you to treat the Quran the same way you treat baba pilot.
Needless to say, a rational modern thinking man (and woman) would discard BOTH of these so-called ‘miracles’. Appears as if we have already rendered Dr. Naik’s booklet void. But anyways, for the sake of a more detailed postmortem, lets delve a bit deeper into Dr. Naik’s arguments.
Zakir Naik says:
THE CHALLENGE OF THE QUR’AAN
“Literature and poetry have been instruments of human expression and creativity, in all cultures. The world also witnessed an age when literature and poetry occupied pride of position, similar to that now enjoyed by science and technology.” Muslims as well as non-Muslims agree that Al-Qur’aan is Arabic literature par excellence – that it is the best Arabic literature on the face of the earth.
The Qur’aan, challenges mankind in the following verses: “And if ye are in doubt As to what We have revealed From time to time to Our Servant, then produce a Soorah Like there unto; And call your witnesses or helpers (If there are any) besides Allah, If your (doubts) are true. But if ye cannot -And of a surety you cannot. Then fear the Fire Whose fuel is Men and Stones – Which is prepared for those Who reject Faith.” [Al-Qur’aan 2:23-24] The challenge of the Qur’aan, is to produce a single Soorah (chapter) like the Soorahs it contains. The same challenge is repeated in the Qur’aan several times. The challenge to produce a Soorah, which, in beauty, eloquence, depth and meaning is at least somewhat similar to a Qur’aanic Soorah remains unmet to this day.
Our response:
Dr. Naik understands that literature and poetry are instruments of HUMAN expression and creativity. This implies that the brilliance or mediocrity of a literary work can only be attributed to a HUMAN and not to some DIVINE entity. Despite that understanding, he naively reproduces the Challenge of the Quran to prove its Divinity.
How can an instrument of human expression prove or disprove the DIVINITY of a text? It’s impossible!
Let’s list down the facts that make the challenge of the Quran self-defeating and naive:

Literary excellence is no guarantee of divinity of a text. So It’s futile to throw or accept this challenge, as it would not prove or disprove the divinity of the book even when the challenge is met!
The challenge builds on a flawed assumption that if no comparable work exists for a given work, then it must be Divine. By that logic, even Mona Lisa is from God and Meghadootam of Kalidas is the word of God because these masterpieces have no parallels. Right?
Another flaw in this challenge is that it sets the challenger as the arbitrator/judge. So any Tom, Dick and Harry with a bunch of his friends can defeat the author of the Quran. All they have to do, is to attest that their friend has written a surah better than the author of the Quran and we’re done!
The biggest blunder of this challenge is that the author of the Quran was unaware of the almost zero structural impact of replacing nouns and pronouns with each other within certain statements/verses . For example, if we change “Muslims” with “kafirs” and “kafirs” with “Muslims” in any verse of the Quran, we would have created an ANTI-QURAN which matches exactly and undoubtedly with the Quran in literary excellence!!!
[[And interestingly this new book, being divine (as it fulfills Allah’s criterion of divinity which was to be something similar or better than Quran in literary excellence), will make Muslim friends along with Zakir Bhai shed tears as they will be now going to the hellfire for eternity and the Kafirs will be enjoying the houris (who were originally meant for Muslims) in everlasting heaven! In addition to it, Muhammad, being a non Muslim (as per new DIVINE book), ceases to be a messenger and thus Quran claimed to be revealed to him loses its divine status ]]
Finally, it’s utterly dumb of a Creator to challenge his Creation to outdo Him. Why would a sensible creator do that? Imagine a car manufacturer (we like the car example because that’s a favorite of Zakir Bhai) throwing challenge at the car to run above its maximum design speed! Such a manufacturer would need a brain check up as he seems to forget that it is HE ALONE who has put the limits to the speed of his car. If he is not sure about the speed limits of his car, it implies that he lacks complete knowledge of his own product! On the other hand, if he does know the speed limits of the car and still challenges it, he needs mental treatment. Thus either Allah is not omniscient or He needs medical attention.
[[Here we would remind you of another eccentricity of the author of Quran in which He first made Adam knowledgeable keeping the angels deliberately dumb and then organized a GK competition between Adam and the illiterate angels! How fair!..Are you still looking for science in Quran? 😉 ]]

In one paragraph we found the irrationality of a Quranic miracle and in the next Dr. Naik offered us an irrational, preposterous challenge of Quran.
I am afraid, as we investigate further…Would we end up concluding that Quran is not meant for rational persons at all? Allah forbid!
[PS: Dear reader, these are additional facts. Not necessary, but good to know in this context:

Many people have produced surahs like the Quran and few could tell the difference .Please Google about the furqan and suralikeit controversy to know more
Many Muslim as well as non-Muslim scholars DO NOT agree with the claim that Al-Quran is literature par excellence. Ali Dashti, a famous scholar punctures this claim quite effectively in his works

Zakir Naik says:
A modern rational man, however, would never accept a religious scripture, which says, in the best possible poetic language, that the world is flat. This is because we live in an age, where human reason, logic and science are given primacy. Not many would accept the Qur’aan’s extraordinarily beautiful language, as proof of its Divine origin.
Our response:
As has been explained above, literary excellence cannot by itself be the proof of divinity. So No rational person would ever accept Quran as divine because of that alone. But Dr. Naik brings up another point in this piece. Here he rightly suggests that if any religious scripture goes against scientifically established fact, it should not be accepted.
Now the question to ask is whether Quran goes against a scientific fact or not? What does the Quran say about the shape of the Earth?
We’ll know very soon 🙂 But please remember, if the Quran goes against a scientifically established truth, Dr. Naik requests you to not accept the Quran as a religious scripture.
Zakir Naik says:
The Qur’aan is not a book of science but a book of ‘signs’, i.e. ayats. There are more than six thousand ‘signs’ in the Qur’aan of which more than a thousand deal with science
Our response:
Dr. Naik’s generalization that 1/6^th of Quran is dedicated to science is without evidence. He does not provide any reference of the 1000+ verses dedicated to science. Appeal to false authority?
As far as signs of Allah are concerned, the less said about them the better. An example of such a sign is the natural phenomenon of eclipse, that is well explained and understood by science. But in Islam, this very natural phenomenon is treated as a ‘sign’ of Allah!
Zakir Naik says:
We all know that many a times Science takes a ‘U-turn’. In this book I have considered only established scientific facts and not mere hypotheses and theories that are based on assumptions and are not backed by proof.
Our response:
Dr. Naik should have elaborated on the criteria he applied to distinguish between established scientific facts and mere theories that are prone to the U-Turn syndrome. It’s a very tricky game even for the scientists 😉 Anyways, let’s give him the benefit of doubt on this one and channel our energies in investigating the evidence (the Quranic Verses) he offers in support of science in the Quran instead.
Zakir Naik says:
I. ASTRONOMY
CREATION OF THE UNIVERSE: ‘THE BIG BANG’
The creation of the universe is explained by astrophysicists in a widely accepted phenomenon, popularly known as the ‘Big Bang’. It is supported by observational and experimental data gathered by astronomers and astrophysicists for decades. According to the ‘Big Bang’, the whole universe was initially one big mass (Primary Nebula). Then there was a ‘Big Bang’ (Secondary Separation) which resulted in the formation of Galaxies. These then divided to form stars, planets, the sun, the moon, etc. The origin of the universe was unique and the probability of it occurring by ‘chance’ is zero. The Qur’aan contains the following verse, regarding the origin of the universe: “Do not the Unbelievers see That the heavens and the earth Were joined together (as one Unit of Creation), before We clove them asunder?” [Al-Qur’aan 21:30]
Our response:
Very poor evidence indeed! And that too factually incorrect!
Dr. Naik has let his imagination loose in correlating big bang with this verse (21:30) of the Quran. Let’s analyze this verse closely.

It starts with “do not the unbelievers SEE” – This can mean two things- a) that the phenomenon being talked about can be actually seen AND/OR b) that the phenomenon being talked about here is already KNOWN to the people who it is being addressed to (unbelievers in this case). Look at it any which way, it only proves that the phenomenon was already known (and possibly verifiable) to the addressees in advance. So there’s no new knowledge that is being revealed here. I don’t know why Dr. Naik chose such a self-defeating verse in the first place.
Then the verse says “that the heavens and earth were joined together, before We clove them asunder?” – This rustic imagination has nothing to do with the big bang. The earth was formed billions of years after the big bang!! And most importantly, earth was not parted from the universe, it is, was and will remain a part of the Universe!

A very bad choice indeed. This verse is scientifically unsound and rustic. It fails in parts and as a whole too 🙁
Another important thing to note is how conveniently (read unscientifically) Dr. Naik assumes the word ‘heaven’ in the verse to mean ‘universe’. Unfortunately, despite this innovation, the verse turned out to be a scientific disaster and a non-revelation.
By the way, the Quranic heaven is a 7 storied building/canopy over the earth. Interestingly, not only the Quranic heaven but the Quranic earth has seven layers too (Quran 65:12 [Yusuf Ali] “Allah is He Who created seven Firmaments and of the earth a similar number.”
(We would not be surprised if Dr. Naik comes up with some multiverse argument to explain the 7 universes, but what will he do about the 7 earths therein?)
So, after having analyzed the evidence (verse 21:30) we find that Quranic model of universe is very much against established scientific facts but it’s in perfect sync with Judaic, Greek view of its time. The author of Quran insists that the heavens can be seen by the unbelievers (or are already known to them).
To be doubly sure that the ‘heaven’ of Quran is NOT the ‘universe’, we look at another verse which unambiguously states that the earth was created first and thereafter the heavens (Universe as per Dr. Naik) were created.
Quran 2:29 “He it is Who created for you all that is on earth. Then He Istawâ (rose over) towards the heaven and made them seven heavens and He is the All-Knower of everything.”
Now going by Dr. Naik’s terminology ,you get from this verse:

a universe that was created after the earth was created !! (Allah had to rise over earth to reach the Universe…Enjoy the science!)
a universe that was smoke while the earth was solid!!!
a universe that was fragmented into 7 layers!!!

What a disaster!
Zakir Naik says:
The striking congruence between the Qur’aanic verse and the ‘Big Bang’ is inescapable! How could a book, which first appeared in the deserts of Arabia 1400 years ago, contain this profound scientific truth?
Our response:
Rather, these verses only corroborate that the author of the Quran was only reiterating what the Arabs of 7th century believed in: 7 layers of flat disc earth and 7 layers of solid canopies of heaven on top. All borrowed from Greek, Talmud myths and reproduced by the author of the Quran.
As if all this was not bad enough, Dr. Naik dishonestly translates the word ‘heaven’ as ‘universe’…and despite that, his evidence not only falls short but goes anti the big-bang theory. We hope, being a modern rational man, he would do a ‘baba pilot’ with the Quran as well after reading this article.
Zakir Naik says:
CREATION OF GALAXIES
Scientists say that before the galaxies in the universe were formed, celestial matter was initially in the form of gaseous matter. In short, huge gaseous matter or clouds were present before the formation of the galaxies. To describe initial celestial matter, the word ‘smoke’ is more appropriate than gas. The following Qur’aanic verse refers to this state of the universe by the word dhukhan which means smoke.
“Moreover, He Comprehended In His design the sky, And it had been (as) smoke: He said to it And to the earth: ‘Come ye together, Willingly or unwillingly.’ They said: ‘We do come (Together), in willing obedience.'” [Al-Qur’aan 41:11]
Our response:
How unscientific of a book which has just one word for sky, heaven, galaxy, universe! That which is heaven for Pickthall, is sky for Yusuf Ali, is Galaxy(!!!!!) for Dr. Naik. And mind you, in one of these Dr. Naiks ‘universes’ (or galaxies?) the author of Quran promises rivers of honey and milk and wine and what not. I hope NASA find’s one such heaven..oops galaxy ..oops Universe!
Just for fun, let’s assume that Dr. Naik is a bigger scholar of Arabic than any of the most reputed ones (like Yusuf Ali, Pickthaal, Hilali, Shakir etc.) and we use ‘Galaxy’ instead of ‘sky’ in the above verse. Even then, the author of the Quran fails miserably.. here’s how:

The verse starts with “Moreover” ..Implying that before the creation of the galaxies, Allah did something else.
We can find what precedes the creation of ‘galaxies’ by reading the preceding verse, of which, 41:11 is an obvious successor – “Quran Verse 41:10
He set on the (earth), mountains standing firm, high above it, and bestowed blessings on the earth, and measure therein all things to give them nourishment in due proportion, in four Days, in accordance with (the needs of) those who seek (Sustenance).”
So what do we have from this verse: The Earth is formed before the formation of galaxies! As if earth is not part of a galaxy!!
Now look the verse 41:11 by itself.. It says the ‘Galaxy’ was a smoke, as if the earth was not! Very Very unscientific!
Read further into the verse “he said to it and the earth: ‘come ye together“.. IS THIS HOW THE GALAXY WAS FORMED? BY coming together of Earth and the rest of the Galaxy? What kind of a joke is this!!! Earth is, was a part of this galaxy… earth was formed with the same “SMOKE” of which the galaxy was formed.

We find that despite the innovative translation of the Quran by Dr. Naik, it still goes against established scientific facts. We are surprised and disheartened that such absurd unscientific arguments find many buyers in the Islamic world. Science has a lot of catching up to do 🙁
Zakir Naik says:
Again, this fact is a corollary to the ‘Big Bang’ and was not known to the Arabs during the time of Prophet Muhammad (pbuh). What then, could have been the source of this knowledge?
Our response:
Dr. Naik .. The source of Quran’s ‘knowledge’ (?) is Greek, Babylonian, Jewish and Christian mythology of its time which it faithfully reproduces. Add to that your unscientific translation of the same word in any which way that suits you. And despite all this hanky panky, your argument still bites the dust.
Zakir Naik says:
THE SPHERICAL SHAPE OF THE EARTH
In early times, people believed that the earth is flat. For centuries, men were afraid to venture out too far, lest they should fall off the edge. Sir Francis Drake was the first person who proved that the earth is spherical when he sailed around it in 1597. Consider the following Qur’aanic verse regarding the alternation of day and night: “Seest thou not that Allah merges Night into Day And He merges Day into Night?” [Al-Qur’aan 31:29]. Merging here means that the night slowly and gradually changes to day and vice versa. This phenomenon can only take place if the earth is spherical. If the earth was flat, there would have been a sudden change from night to day and from day to night.
The following verse also alludes to the spherical shape of the earth: “He created the heavens And the earth In true (proportions): He makes the Night Overlap the Day, and the Day Overlap the Night.” [Al-Qur’aan 39:5] The Arabic word used here is Kawwara meaning ‘to overlap’ or ‘to coil’- the way a turban is wound around the head. The overlapping or coiling of the day and night can only take place if the earth is spherical.
Our response:

The underlined claim is false. A flat-disc earth with sun moving in a canopy above it will also result in gradual change of night and day. Thus, using this as an argument in support of a spherical earth is void.
By the way , Let’s look at the complete verse (31:29) “Seest thou not that Allah merges Night into Day and he merges Day into Night; that He has subjected the sun, and the moon (to his Law), each running its course for a term appointed; and that Allah is well-acquainted with all that ye do?” [verse 39:5 repeats the same claim]This verse when looked at in its entirety exposes the naïve understanding of the author of the Quran. The author believes that night merges into day and day merges into night because sun and moon follow their courses around the earth at appointed intervals. It’s a scientific blunder that assumes a geocentric world (as the Greeks used to believe)
Also, the verse in its entirety is talking about how Allah makes night and day using sun and moon. It nowhere talks about the shape of the earth…or for that matter it does not talk about the earth at all! It talks about the courses of the sun and moon (not of earth).
Gradual change of day into night and vice versa is a PLAIN OBSERVATION for anybody. It does not require any rocket science to be appreciated. Coupling this observation with the fact that Quran talks of spherical earth is as foolish as claiming that Quran talks about nuclear fusion because it mentions somewhere that the sun shines! Rather than fulfilling his promise of an objective analysis, we find that Dr. Naik has surrendered to his wild imagination to hunt for science in the Quran.

Dear reader, we know that you would have called the bluff of Dr. Naik by now. But let’s bear with a few more ‘evidences’ of Dr. Naik. Let this be dealt with once and for all.
Zakir Naik says:
The earth is not exactly round like a ball, but geo-spherical i.e. it is flattened at the poles. The following verse contains a description of the earth’s shape “And the earth, moreover, Hath He made egg shaped.” [Al-Qur’aan 79:30]
The Arabic word for egg here is dahaha, which means an ostrich-egg. The shape of an ostrich-egg resembles the geo-spherical shape of the earth. Thus the Qur’aan correctly describes the shape of the earth, though the prevalent notion when the Qur’aan was revealed was that the earth is flat
Our response:
As expected, the translation of the above verse is NOT from YUSUF ALI, it’s a later day addition by apologists like Dr. Naik. Here are the three reputed translations:
YUSUFALI: And the earth, moreover, hath He extended (to a wide expanse);
PICKTHAL: And after that He spread the earth,
SHAKIR: And the earth, He expanded it after that.
Al-Taqiyya is at play and Dr. Naik deviates from his assurance that he would quote from Yusuf Ali. He created his own translation!!! Not a single scholar worth his salt translated dahaha as egg-shaped.
Well, that’s enough to refute this concoction But let’s refute it thoroughly:

The word ‘dahaha’ DOES NOT mean Ostrich-egg…it means to flatten, roll out, spread etc as per the most trusted Arabic dictionaries. No Arabic dictionary of repute can make such a phenomenal blunder, but Dr. Naik is unfazed nonetheless, he is happy with his innovation. He must be reminded that Innovation is a GREAT SIN in Islam
Again, even if hypothetically dahaha meant egg shaped, then again, scientifically speaking, the earth is an oblate spheroid and not an ovoid like the ostrich egg
Now let’s look at other places where the Quran talks about the shape of the earth

Quran 50:7 “And the earth have We spread out, and have flung firm hills therein, and have caused of every lovely kind to grow thereon”. [Waal-ardamadadnahawaalqaynafeeharawasiyawaanbatnafeeha min kullizawjinbaheejin]
The word used here is madadnaha – which means spread out, make plain, flatten – nothing spherical about it. [Quran 50:7]
Quran 91:6 “And the earth and Him Who spread it [Waal-ardiwamatahaha]
Quran 71:19 “‘And Allah has made the earth for you as a carpet (spread out), [ WaAllahujaAAalalakumu al-ardabisatan ]

From the evidence above, we can safely ask Dr. Zakir Naik to take his ostrich egg back to his ostrich farm and not confuse Muslims as well as non-Muslims on the straight forward translations of the Quranic words/verses by the most reputed scholars of Quran.
And if there is still residual doubt in your minds, let’s read this verse of the author of Quran 79:19 “‘And Allah has made the earth for you as a carpet (spread out),”
[Have you seen a spherical carpet? 😉 ]
Now let’s puncture Dr. Naik’s other claim that the prevalent notion at the time of Quran was that the earth is flat. We share with you the scientific understanding about earth’s shape and SIZE during the same time period (actually a century prior to) when the Quran was revealed. Aryabhatta was an Indian mathematician and wrote his treatise Aryabhatiya in 499 CE:

Aryabhatta tells us that the Moon and planets shine by reflected sunlight and that the orbits of the planets are ellipses.
[The author of the Quran was unaware of the fact that all planets reflect sunlight 🙁 ]
He also correctly explained the causes of eclipses of the Sun and the Moon.
[Muslims including the prophet [and many Hindus even today] used to pray during eclipses because they did not understand this natural phenomenon. They thought it to be one of Allah’s or God’s signs – Quran is after all a book of signs 😉 ]
His value for the length of the sidereal year at 365 days 6 hours 12 minutes 30 seconds is only 3 minutes 20 seconds longer than the true value of 365 days 6 hours 9 minutes 10 seconds.
[Now that’s what we call a substantial claim. Not something rustic like “we have divided the year into four seasons” kind of banal stuff]
He estimated the value of ‘Pi’ as: “Add four to one hundred, multiply by eight and then add sixty-two thousand. The result is approximately the circumference of a circle of diameter twenty thousand. By this rule the relation of the circumference to diameter is given.” In other words, Pi=62832/20000 = 3.1416, correct to four rounded-off decimal places.
[PI is needed for anybody who understands circles (forget about spheres). The author of the Quran didn’t have anything to opine in this regard in his ‘1000+ scientific verses”?]
Aryabhatta accurately calculated the Earth’s circumference as 24,835 miles, which was only 0.2% smaller than the actual value of 24,902 miles. This approximation remained the most accurate for over a thousand years [i.e. 100 years before Islam and 900 years after the advent of Islam !]
source: http://www.archive.org/details/The_Aryabhatiya_of_Aryabhata_Clark_1930

Dear Readers, please compare Aryabhatta’s knowledge on the shape and circumference of the earth versus Allah’s vague revelation that the earth is an expanse or even Dr. Naik’s innovative translation that earth is ostrich egg shaped (which is anyways wrong). Which one of the two sounds like science?
And don’t forget, Aryabhatta revealed all this a century before the author of the Quran came up with his so called scientific verses!
Guess what? Aryabhatta was 23 years old when he gave us his marvelous treatise on Astronomy, Algebra, Spherical geometry, trigonometry etc.
THUS IF MUHAMMAD BE REGARDED AS PROPHET BECAUSE OF THE SIGNS OR SCIENCE HE IS CLAIMED TO HAVE GIVEN IN A BOOK CALLED QURAN, ARYABHATTA DESERVES TO BE REGARDED AS AN EVEN BIGGER PROPHET FOR GIVING MUCH MORE ACUURATE SCIENCE IN HIS BOOK. If Quran be basis for regarding Muhammad as Rasul, then Aryabhatta is the true Rasul.
The derivatives of Aryabhatta’s work reached an Arab (Al-Khwarizmi), who translated it into Arabic and consequently took this knowledge to the West. He is now known as the father of algebra!
[Thank God! He was smart enough to know where to look for scientific knowledge from – and it was NOT the Quran]
Wondering why this particular rebuttal is so long and comprehensive? Well! Don’t you remember what Dr. Naik said? He said that if any scripture says that the earth is flat, you must discard that scripture. Now you know what you have to do..don’t you?
Zakir Naik says:
THE LIGHT OF THE MOON IS REFLECTED LIGHT
It was believed by earlier civilizations that the moon emanates its own light. Science now tells us that the light of the moon is reflected light. However this fact was mentioned in the Qur’aan 1,400 years ago in the following verse:. “Blessed is He Who made Constellations in the skies, And placed therein a Lamp And a Moon giving light.” [Al-Qur’aan 25:61]
The Arabic word for the sun in the Qur’aan, is shams. It is referred to as siraaj, which means a ‘torch’ or as wahhaaj which means ‘a blazing lamp’ or as diya which means ‘shining glory’. All three descriptions are appropriate to the sun, since it generates intense heat and light by its internal combustion. The Arabic word for the moon is qamar and it is described in the Qur’aan as muneer, which is a body that gives nur i.e. light. Again, the Qur’aanic description matches perfectly with the true nature of the moon, which does not give off light itself and is an inert body that reflects the light of the sun. Not once in the Qur’aan, is the moon mentioned as siraaj, wahhaaj or diya or the sun as nur or muneer. This implies that the Qur’aan recognizes the difference between the nature of sunlight and moonlight.
The Arabic word dahaha has been translated by A. Yusuf Ali as “vast expanse”, which also is correct. The word dahaha also means an ostrich-egg
Consider the following verses related to the nature of light from the sun and the moon: “It is He who made the sun To be a shining glory And the moon to be a light (Of beauty).” [Al-Qur’aan 10:5] “See ye not How Allah has created The seven heavens One above another, “And made the moon A light in their midst, and made the sun As a (Glorious) Lamp?” [Al-Qur’aan 71:15-16]’
Our response:

As has been already shared, Aryabhatta not only explained that moon and other planets reflect the sun’s light but also explained eclipses. Dr. Naik needs to read about some great non-Arabic civilizations of the time (I wonder how he missed this one being born in a civilization as great as Indian – anyways).
Now if Dr. Naik is to be believed, Nur means reflected light. No previous Islamic scholar has made this scandalous claim before – and do you know why? Because one of the 99 Names of the God of Quran (Allah) is AN-Nur. If we translate this word according to Dr. Naik’s definition Allah’s name would become: THE REFLECTED LIGHT! Now the question to ask Dr. Naik is that if Allah is “reflected light” who is the Original Light Source? [We await Dr. Naik’s answer to this question eagerly]
Dr. Naik, probably embarrassed, has not shared the entire verses 71:15-16. Here they are
15-16 “See ye not how Allah has created the seven heavens one above another. And made the moon a light in their midst, and made the sun as a (Glorious) Lamp?” So what do we have here:
–Again the Greek/Judaic philosophical thought of 7 heavens in which various stars and planets and sun and moon can be SEEN by the naked eye. Hence Allah’s insistence in this verse too. He is asking everybody to look at the planets which are visible at dawn and dusk, the stars, the planets, the moon all believed to be stationed in their respective layers of the 7 layered heaven
–Another blunder is that Moon is placed IN BETWEEN (in the midst of) these Layers. Another verse tells us that stars are in the lower heavens.. implying that moon is farther than the stars from us
Another big hole in this argument is that it ties Nur with Moon. Aryabhatta told us 100 years before Quran that ALL PLANETS reflect sun light. Earth is also a Nur (borrowing Dr. Naik innovative translation) when looked from the Moon. [Ask Rakesh Sharma or Neil Armstrong. Better use Google].

Yes, Yes we do understand that all this is more than enough to debunk Dr. Naik’s entire booklet. Kindly let us know any other ‘scientific miracle‘ [oxymoron!] you are finding difficult to refute. We’ll respond in the comments section. Thanks for going through the looong article.
So Long!
Download as PDF: Science in Quran
Science in Quran
[mybooktable book=”science-blissful-living” display=”summary” buybutton_shadowbox=”true”]

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208 COMMENTS

sanatanaakki March 17, 2011 At 5:41 pm

I read the whole article …. Its brilliant….
I love u Agniveer.com
JAI HIND!!

truth seeker March 17, 2011 At 6:01 pm

Namaste brother
I am frustrate by reading the claim of Jakir Naik. Mujhe lagata hai Issse bada Gadha Duniya me koi Nahi Hai. He is shameless person. How can he bring good for people. Jakir Naik does not try to understand it is 21th century, people are educated think with logic how can they believe in things like breaking moon by etc.

roger March 18, 2011 At 2:03 pm

good work brother Indian Agnostic.

- indianagnostic March 18, 2011 At 8:11 pm
  
  Namaste Roger Bro
  TY..This time round brother Vajra is the silent contributor.
  
  - Vik March 19, 2011 At 5:56 am
    
    Great Work brother Indian Agnostic!! and thanks Agniveer Admin for posting such greatness!!
    Now, Naik will get trapped especially by the Dahaha Duhya argument.
    If any muslim reasons with you besides showing your good work, show them this video as well
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3bOVZDWEL8o
  - Indian Agnostic March 19, 2011 At 10:28 pm
    
    Great Video Brother Vik!
  - Sameer March 19, 2011 At 10:32 pm
    
    Bro Vik Great Video now what will Zakir Naiks Chamchas have to say about this.
  - Indian Agnostic March 19, 2011 At 10:39 pm
    
    Namaste Sameer Bro,
    going by the responses of mansoor and mahmood bro, it seems that they will cling to untruth even when it is thoroughly exposed 🙁
    mahmood believes that the moon is situated in one of the 7 atmospheric layers of the earth , while mahmood bro thinks that replacing “in the midts” with “therein” would change the obvious meaning of the verse.
    I hope they gather the courage to reject falsity
  - Vik March 21, 2011 At 7:41 am
    
    @Sameer
    Namaste Brother Sameer
    Zakir’s chamchas and Zakir himself will say the same old thing that they always been saying which is “brathdar, you aar quoting out of context”
Vajra March 18, 2011 At 7:47 pm

Surprised to see no Islamic scientist till now on the page 🙁

- indianagnostic March 18, 2011 At 8:15 pm
  
  Lolz ..No car manufacturer around it seems 😉
  
  - sanatanaakki March 18, 2011 At 9:08 pm
    
    do u write all this articles…..can i ask u Mahindra Pal Arya ji also help in it ?
    JAI HIND…
  - Arya Musafir March 18, 2011 At 10:00 pm
    
    @Sanatanaakki
    Namaste Brother
    We have many scholars from different fields such as Vedas, philosophy, science, Islam etc and Shri Mahendra Pal Arya is one of the Islamic experts who contributes in the ground level activities rather than content generation. We have separate team of authors which only concentrates on writing.
    Dhanyawad
  - sanatanaakki March 18, 2011 At 10:09 pm
    
    @ Arya Musafir.
    Dhanyawad for replying…
  - Indian Agnostic March 18, 2011 At 10:37 pm
    
    Namaste Brother Sanatanakki
    Pandit Ji is doing a great service indeed.Like you , i also am hoping if i can see any of his freshly recorded debates.hope he finds the time from his busy schedule
    Best regards
Mahmood March 18, 2011 At 9:18 pm

Please visit http://www.harunyahya.com/
Your article is highly illogical.Seven layers above earth and inside refers to 7 layer of atmosphere and 7 layers inside earth.
You all seem to lack basic science of 10th standard.Pity on You.May u all read Quran with you parents and come out of gutter of Hindusim.
May PBUH and Allah forgive you all.All of you are fighting the lost battle.

- Islam=non sense March 18, 2011 At 9:41 pm
  
  Your Islamic miracles are hilarious even for a 3 year old kid.I would rather believe in mythological fairy tales then your pedophile prophet who married his own daughter in law,had concubines and a mass murderer.I have read the Quran,why do i want my parents to learn that disgusting hate and intolerant book.Look at this video lol your mullah Joker nalayak exposed
  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ymf5MdwK3M8&feature=player_embedded
  
  - Sameer March 18, 2011 At 11:36 pm
    
    IDIOT’s RESEARCH FOUNDATION AKA IRF.NET have come with new idiotic research to rape science.
  - Vik March 19, 2011 At 5:49 am
    
    @Sameer
    Namaste Sameer
    “IDIOT’s RESEARCH FOUNDATION”
    excellent brother, this trully describes them, I cannot stop laughing, thanks for giving me a good laugh today.
  - roger March 19, 2011 At 11:25 am
    
    @islam=nonsense
    thnx for sharing this excellent video.
    @sameer.
    ‘IDIOT’s RESEARCH FOUNDATION'(IRF)
    haha…good one bro
  - sanatanaakki March 19, 2011 At 8:59 pm
    
    This video is awesome.!!
    NO NOTHING….
  - Rj3865 May 17, 2011 At 5:49 am
    
    @ritesh swami
    This video you posted is simply based on corruption and has nothing to do with hinduism , nd anyhow you will not even get these in more number as compared to those of muslims and specially their terrorist attacks . Brother will you please clear your concept that for what you are standing and plz avoid posting these videos like fools cause anyone can most 10times more than that against islam and joker naik..
  - learner to faith March 21, 2011 At 7:27 pm
    
    rocking video !! what has zakir fans to say on this !! really awesome video .. must watch!!
  - Rj3865 May 17, 2011 At 5:53 am
    
    @learner to faith
    Can you please tell me wats awesome in it , this video simply shows corruption nothing else ..
- Indian Agnostic March 18, 2011 At 9:45 pm
  
  Namaste Mahmood
  Seven layers above earth and inside refers to 7 layer of atmosphere and 7 layers inside earth.
  Lolzzzzzzzzzzz ! you seem to be a madarsa trained science blind badmouthing moron.
  Didn’t you read this verse of the Quran ?
  Quran 71:15-16 : “‘See ye not how Allah has created the seven heavens one above another, And made the moon a light in their midst, and made the sun as a (Glorious) Lamp?”
  This verse says that moon is in the midst of these 7 layers.
  do you want to tell me that the Moon is situated in the midst of your 7 atmospheric layers of the earth?
  in the gutter! … who?
  
  - Sameer March 18, 2011 At 11:40 pm
    
    Nice work Indian agnostic brother
  - mansoor March 19, 2011 At 3:11 am
    
    To Indian Agnostic
    Indian Agnostic said:
    Quran 71:15-16 : “‘See ye not how Allah has created the seven heavens one above another, And made the moon a light in their midst, and made the sun as a (Glorious) Lamp?”
    This verse says that moon is in the midst of these 7 layers.
    do you want to tell me that the Moon is situated in the midst of your 7 atmospheric layers of the earth?
    My Response:
    You are appealing to weak translation. In the Arabic text, “midst” is not there.The translator has put his own words in the translation.The Arabic word used is “fihin” which means:
    “in, at, on, therein”
    A more accurate translation of verse 16:
    “And made the moon therein a [reflected] light and made the sun a burning lamp?”
  - Vajra March 19, 2011 At 3:05 pm
    
    Namaste mansoor
    ———– You are appealing to weak translation.———–
    1. So it is proven that Zakir Naik uses false translations to show science and Yusuf Ali is not the authentic translation which Zakir uses all the time. Will you please condemn Zakir Naik for his falsehood and hidden agenda of maligning Islam with his stupid interpretations?
    2. The article is based on Zakir Naik’s book and his claims therein about science. Why are you relating it with Quran?
    ———— In the Arabic text, “midst” is not there.The translator has put his own words in the translation.The Arabic word used is “fihin” which means:
    “in, at, on, therein”————-
    Even if this verse is translated as per your suggestions, allegation of Brother Indian Agnostic is still valid. If I say – “Earth’s atmosphere and the clouds therein”, it simply means that clouds are WITHIN the atmosphere. So again moon is proven to be inside earth’s atmosphere as per your translation 🙁
  - Mansoor March 23, 2011 At 2:13 am
    
    To Vajra
    Response to your point no 1
    Translation is just a human work and human work may contain some mistakes.These mistakes can be removed with a help of using original source that is Quran.So if there are some mistakes in a translation then we should not doubt the intention of translator.Translation of Quran into any language cannot be equivalent to its original language that is Araby.So there is no any hidden agenda of Zakir except to spread the true message of Islam.
    Response to your point no 2 and your last paragraph which was about moon location in earth’s atmosphere:
    I must point out here that there are lot of people who focus on the statements of the Quran related to science.They donot realize that it is not a book of science.It is a book of signs.The scientific facts have been stated as supporting arguments.The Quran actually comments on Allah’s attributes and their material evidence and uses scientific facts as a proof.And these statements are flawless.Science has proved what the Quran has stated.
    Surah 71 verses 15 and 16 donot say that moon is inside the earth’s atmosphere.We all know that scientifically moon is not present in a earth’s atmosphere or layers of our earth’s atmosphere e.g;troposphere,stratosphere,ozone etc.Let me quote a verses again:
    Do you not see how Allah has created the seven heavens,~one above another
    And made the moon therein a light,and made the sun a lamp?
    Let me explain few things here:
    “seven” in Arabic,also expresses a plurality;the expression “seven heavens” may either mean the number seven as the actual number of heavens,or a plurality of heavens.Therefore,the seven heavens may mean a large number of heavens or universes.Great islamic scholar Javed Ahmed Ghamidi said about seven heavens:
    “Quran states this whole universe is a single heaven,thus stating a fact.We are still understanding this single heaven.Thus there are still six heavens or universes”
    In an arabic langauge,singular of heaven is samaa whereas plural is samawat.so heaven is used to refer to the sky above the earth,as well as the entire universes.
    Allah knows best.
    Note:errors may be expected in my response.
  - Vajra March 23, 2011 At 4:57 pm
    
    Brother Mansoor
    ———–Translation is just a human work and human work may contain some mistakes.———-
    Exactly! So you agree that Allah made mistake while giving His final and perfect revelation only in Arabic leaving rest of the others (non Arabs) at the mercy of human works (translations) which can have errors?
    ———–These mistakes can be removed with a help of using original source that is Quran.———-
    1. How does a Non Arab decide which translator is worthy of being trusted and which is not? After all he/she is totally devoid of any knowledge about Arabic.
    2. How can a Non Arab, firstly recognize and then remove the mistakes of translator being unaware of the language of original source?
    ———–So if there are some mistakes in a translation then we should not doubt the intention of translator.———–
    Cant any translator have malign intentions?
    ———– Translation of Quran into any language cannot be equivalent to its original language that is Araby.————
    Please see my first reply in the same post.
    ————So there is no any hidden agenda of Zakir except to spread the true message of Islam.————-
    When it is proven that Zakir has mistranslated the words of Quran, how can he be considered truthful? Or you mean truthful in Islamic terms means someone who is hell bent in making people believe in Islam by hook or by crook?
    ————They donot realize that it is not a book of science.It is a book of signs.————
    If so, how wise it is to show science from a book which is not scientific?
    ———- The scientific facts have been stated as supporting arguments.———–
    And those supporting arguments have thoroughly been exposed in the article.
    ———–Science has proved what the Quran has stated.————-
    Could you refute the article to claim so?
    ———–Surah 71 verses 15 and 16 donot say that moon is inside the earth’s atmosphere.————
    Again reminding you the article refutes THE CLAIMS OF ZAKIR NAIK and not Quran. Why dont you understand it friend?
    ————“seven” in Arabic,also expresses a plurality;the expression “seven heavens” may either mean the number seven as the actual number of heavens,or a plurality of heavens.———–
    1. So you agree that those who show science of atmospheric layers from this verse are wrong?
    2. So which science according to you, this verse shows?
    ———In an arabic langauge,singular of heaven is samaa whereas plural is samawat.so heaven is used to refer to the sky above the earth,as well as the entire universes.———-
    1. Talking about above or below proves that Quran believes in flat earth because for a spherical earth, nothing is above or below 🙂
    2. What is sky BTW?
    3. What is there above first heaven (i.e. in 2nd, 3rd,….7th heaven) since all of the universe comes into first heaven itself as per you? How the boundaries of heavens are decided?
    ———-Note:errors may be expected in my response.———–
    Yes, we accept that! And same for all of us. But problem comes when someone starts assigning hell to others for not believing in his version of religion forgetting that his own understanding of religion can have errors 🙁 This is what we are against to and thus exposing the terrorist Zakir Naik and company who thinks they have copyright over truth and non believers will burn in hell for not following it
    best regards
  - Mansoor March 23, 2011 At 2:18 am
    
    To Vajra
    Response to your point no 1
    Translation is just a human work and human work may contain some mistakes.These mistakes can be removed with a help of using original source that is Quran.So if there are some mistakes in a translation then we should not doubt the intention of translator.Translation of Quran into any language cannot be equivalent to its original language that is Araby.So there is no any hidden agenda of Zakir except to spread the true message of Islam.
    Response to your point no 2 and your last paragraph which was about moon location in earth’s atmosphere:
    I must point out here that there are lot of people who focus on the statements of the Quran related to science.They donot realize that it is not a book of science.It is a book of signs.The scientific facts have been stated as supporting arguments.The Quran actually comments on Allah’s attributes and their material evidence and uses scientific facts as a proof.And these statements are flawless.Science has proved what the Quran has stated.
  - Vajra March 23, 2011 At 4:58 pm
    
    Mansoor
    Replied above
  - Ram August 21, 2012 At 9:08 pm
    
    I confused with muslims claim that Quran is a scientific and has got astrological evidences in that. If so then why you are celebrating Ramdan on different months i.e it rotates the whole year, my question is that if your astrology is so strong then why don’t it celebrated on particular day every year. You are the biggest fools in the world who are following a war manual called Quran
  - Mahomood March 19, 2011 At 4:58 pm
    
    Quran 71:15-16 : “‘See ye not how Allah has created the seven heavens one above another, And made the moon a light in their midst, and made the sun as a (Glorious) Lamp?”
    Yes If you see we have seven layers which modern science proves in atmosphere and Moon looks right shining through it in early morning.
    I am really sorry brother I have provided you some good links but u never read it.Typical Temple mentality of hindus.False god,false religion and false worshipers.
    Shame on you friend.Quran says idol worshipers are divided by heart.See you all are.
  - Islam=non sense March 19, 2011 At 6:01 pm
    
    Your bullshit miracle is refuted by a ex muslim in the video i posted below.Typical low mentality of Muslims.False god,stupid religion and a pedo prophet.Shame on you.Muslims themselves are divided by heart.sunnies,shias,ahmadiyas.
  - Vajra March 19, 2011 At 8:04 pm
    
    Namaste Mahomood (Mahamoodh :))
    You should first sort out the issue with another Islamic scientist Mansoor who has opposite view than yours on this verse. He says-
    “””””” You are appealing to weak translation. In the Arabic text, “midst” is not there.The translator has put his own words in the translation.The Arabic word used is “fihin” which means:
    “in, at, on, therein”
    A more accurate translation of verse 16:
    “And made the moon therein a [reflected] light and made the sun a burning lamp?”””””””
    So your discovery is opposed by your fellow scientist 🙁
    There is huge difference b/w what “looks” to us and what actually is, but Allah was unaware of this fact. He thought moon is inside the atmosphere of earth as it looks so to Him. That is why He revealed
    “And MADE the moon a light in their midst” INSTEAD OF “And made you LOOK the moon a light in their midst”
    —————-I am really sorry brother I have provided you some good links but u never read it.Typical Temple mentality of hindus.False god,false religion and false worshipers. Shame on you friend.Quran says idol worshipers are divided by heart.See you all are.————–
    Let me show you the typical Masjid/Madarsa mentality which feels proud to be called as DOGS and not only that they bark with full unity to show they are not divided as idol worshipper HUMANS 🙂
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XdKEWyCyfxs
  - saviour April 12, 2011 At 6:28 pm
    
    @Mahmood
    Brother Kaaba is also form of idol worshipping.
    “Circumambulating the Kaaba is a symbolic act of worship, whose wisdom may be hidden from some. It indicates the believer’s utter submission to Almighty Allah alone. The pilgrims go to Hajj in response to the divine order that Prophet Ibrahim or Prophet Abraham (peace be upon him) conveyed to people.”
    Kaaba is not an idol (as muslim claim) but it is an object? Right!! If I am correct idolatry is worshipping an object (which we call “idol”) and the above statement is from a muslim and he pointed out muslim circumambulate the Kaaba (a object). Circumambulate is an act of worship hence muslim also do idol (object) worshipping.
    Now that’s a big contradiction in Quran and as a lot of muslim claim one mistake is enough to prove a scripture is not from the God almighty.
    Thanks you. I have proved my point and now its up to you to understand it. 🙂
- Vajra March 18, 2011 At 10:46 pm
  
  Mahmood
  Today I got to know that Allah sits on exosphere which is coincidentally the seventh heaven of scientist Mahmood 🙂
  And Brother IA pointed out another invention from this Madarsa scientist that the moon is inside the earth’s atmosphere 🙂 Good one Brother IA!
  @Mahmood
  This is the first time you have written filth so giving you the chance to improve. So be careful next time before calling something gutter
  
- saroj May 12, 2011 At 7:35 pm
  
  FOOL THERE ARE 5 ATMOSPHERICAL LAYERS:
  Troposphere
  The troposphere starts at the Earth’s surface and extends to about 15 kilometers (9 miles) high. This part of the atmosphere is the most dense. As you climb higher in this layer, the temperature drops from about 17 to -52 degrees Celsius. Almost all weather is in this region. The tropopause separates the troposphere from the next layer. The tropopause and the troposphere are known as the lower atmosphere.
  Stratosphere
  The stratosphere starts just above the troposphere and extends to 50 kilometers (31 miles) high. Compared to the troposphere, this part of the atmosphere is dry and less dense. The temperature in this region increases gradually to -3 degrees Celsius, due to the absorbtion of ultraviolet radiation. The ozone layer, which absorbs and scatters the solar ultraviolet radiation, is in this layer. Ninety-nine percent of “air” is located in the troposphere and stratosphere. The stratopause separates the stratosphere from the next layer.
  Mesosphere
  The mesosphere starts just above the stratosphere and extends to 85 kilometers (53 miles) high. In this region, the temperatures again fall as low as -93 degrees Celsius as you increase in altitude. The chemicals are in an excited state, as they absorb energy from the Sun. The mesopause separates the mesophere from the thermosphere.
  The regions of the stratosphere and the mesosphere, along with the stratopause and mesopause, are called the middle atmosphere by scientists. This area has been closely studied on the ATLAS Spacelab mission series.
  Thermosphere
  The thermosphere starts just above the mesosphere and extends to 600 kilometers (372 miles) high. The temperatures go up as you increase in altitude due to the Sun’s energy. Temperatures in this region can go as high as 1,727 degrees Celsius. Chemical reactions occur much faster here than on the surface of the Earth. This layer is known as the upper atmosphere.
  The upper and lower layers of the thermosphere will be studied more closely during the Tethered Satellite Mission (TSS-1R).
  THE TOPMOST ONE IS EXOSPHERE
  BUT YOUR QURAN SAYS AS 7!
  FROM WHERE THE EXTRA 2 I DONT KNOW
  ALSO THE QURAN SAYS:
  Allah is He Who created seven Firmaments and of the earth a similar numbe,/B>r. Through the midst of them (all) descends His Command: that ye may know that Allah has power over all things, and that Allah comprehends, all things in (His) Knowledge.
  Qur’an 65:12
  IF 7 HEVENS ARE LAYERS OF ATM., THEN HOW COME THEY HAVE “EARTHS”
  “See ye not how Allah has created the seven heavens one above another,
  ‘And made the moon a light in their midst, and made the sun as a (Glorious) Lamp”<QURAN Qur'an 71:15-16
  But stars are in the nearest/lowest part of the universe.
  Surely We have adorned the nearest heaven with an adornment, the stars
  Qur’an 37:6
  IF THE SO-CALLED “HEAVENS” ARE THE LAYAERS OF ATM.’, THEN HOW CAN THEY HAVE “MOONS” AND “PLANETS” AND “STARS” ?
  SO,
  YOUR CLAIM THAT THE 7 HEAVENS ARE ATMOSPHERIC LAYERS IS INACCURATE
  PEACE B UPON U ALL FOOLS
  
Mahmood March 18, 2011 At 9:20 pm

Do read these and then reply.What you have put is crap.
http://www.harunyahya.com/en.m_download_list.php

- Indian Agnostic March 18, 2011 At 9:33 pm
  
  Namaste Mahmood
  It’s you who needs to read this against harun yahya crap
  http://www.answering-islam.net/authors/katz/rebuttals/yahya.html
  enjoy!
  by the way ..you couldn’t build up an argument reading yahya’s stuff..so its futile to read that guy any ways
  
- Vajra March 18, 2011 At 10:50 pm
  
  Mahmood
  Do you possess something of your own? Pasting the links from like minded idiots is all what you do
  
mansoor March 19, 2011 At 3:27 am

To Everyone
Dr. Zahlool Al-Najjar is a great Muslim Geologist and Scientist who wrote many books, publications, and 10s of journals and reports proving many of the Noble Quranic Geological and Scientific Claims to be accurate through Modern Science and Technologies.
He is well known in the Scientists community of Geology in both the US and Europe, because much of his work and research, especially during his early days of scientific research, was done in these countries while he resided and studied in them.
Here is his English site:
http://www.elnaggarzr.com/en/index.php

- KalBhairav March 19, 2011 At 12:56 pm
  
  @mansoor:
  If Quran is so scientific, why didnt Muslims invade medieval Europe forcing the Europeans to believe in a spherical earth when they were under the wrong impression that the earth was flat in the 12-13th century? Why stupidly try to impose Mohammed on them, when the invasion could have been vindicated had it been carried out on the basis of spherical earth vs flat earth?
  
  - Mansoor March 23, 2011 At 10:37 am
    
    For sake of argument,if early muslims thought the earth was flat,so what?That belief wouldnot reflect what Quran say.
    Quran is not a book of science.it is a book of signs.The scientific facts have been stated as supporting arguments and these arguments are flawless.
  - Vajra March 23, 2011 At 3:58 pm
    
    Namaste Brother Mansoor
    So what about the article? How earth is like carpet? 🙂
- Vajra March 19, 2011 At 3:14 pm
  
  Brother mansoor
  You have failed to understand the essence of the article completely 🙁
  Article deals with ZAKIR’S claims of science in Quran and not QURANIC claims about science. We know Quran does not claim anywhere to have science.
  So instead of suggesting us the links of scientists, please go to IRF and ask them to stop publishing such nonsense so that Islam is not mocked anymore on the intellectual forums.
  
Islam=non sense March 19, 2011 At 12:35 pm

I guess Muslims are living in a fantasy world.They think Quran is a book of Science? ignorant fools.But still all the discoveries were made by infidels.These fools are memorizing and reading the same book for 1400 years,i just wonder how come they did not find any Science then.No where in prestigious Science journals they have refereed to this stupid miracles.They just quote some verses to suit modern science.Muslims cannot invent anything or contribute something to science,so they rely on their terror manual called Quran to find science.Many scientists are accused in USA for taking petro dollars from shaiks to speak or convince infidels that there is some science present in Quran.There are some miracles this muslims frequently claim they are present in Quran.They all have been refuted in this video by a ex muslim.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pwMBOynKpXE&feature=related

sarang March 19, 2011 At 1:18 pm

http://www.faithfreedom.org/features/news/a-jewish-family-massacred/

sds March 19, 2011 At 3:03 pm

Dear Muslims
In one of his video Dr Naik claims Kabaa is in Center of Earth and circle have only one center.
In another video he claims earth is like OSTRICH EGG.
How could both be possible. If Earth is like circle, Quran claims of Ostrich egg shape is wrong, if it is Egg shaped, earth is a circle is wrong. please analyze this and conclude yourself.
Dr Naik is telling lie and trying to make Fool of his semi Illiterate audience.

- Vajra March 19, 2011 At 3:49 pm
  
  Nice one Brother sds!
  
even i cud be the next prophet... :) March 21, 2011 At 12:46 am

well i dont see many muslim brothers here.. is that bczz they too realize that they have not much to speak about except some links to videos and articles of other mortal humans….???
or is it bcz they dont understand science much……????
whatever the case might be… the fact remains that quran is just another holy book which has some rules and regulation for its followers and has very little to do with science….
my grandma used to tell me a story abt a monkey who was thrashed on his ass and his ass was all swollen and red… she told me that that story was told to her by her grandma… so does that make my great great grandma a scientist and a prophet bcz she knew it very well that a monkey had a red ass without even looing at his ass..
well i know wht ever i said was crap and made no sense.. but thats the point… its not worse than the comparison of scientific facts with quran.
let it just be a holy book and let it get some respect from other faiths… venturing into new unknown dark areas(for many of uneducated muslims) is only going to risk its reputation as a genuine holy book… much like the old scientific theories of the world abt flat earth…….

truth seeker March 21, 2011 At 12:33 pm

Namaste Brother,
Kuran is = Blind Faith.
If you shows sun to follower of Kuran he will call it moon because Kuran say so.It is just for example. If he start asking question himself logically he will feel shameful about himself because he was on wrong track till know. That is why he try to understand his mind that he is on right track.
And if you have to go to heaven- kill the animals, rape with woman, marry with 6 year old girl & marry with the woman age of your mother, declare yourself prophet, declare God a dependent of prophet. Only than you can go in heaven like Mohamad Ji. I think it is easy and interesting way of heaven. Please think on it without logic.

truth seeker March 21, 2011 At 4:43 pm

@ even i cud be the next prophet…
but you need to these thing to be prophet
kill the animals, rape with woman, marry with 6 year old girl & marry with the woman age of your mother, declare yourself prophet, declare God a dependent of prophet. Only than you can be prophet and go in heaven like Mohamad Ji.
And do not worry if someone call you lustful, sinner, monster than I will give them argument that all this like rape, child marry, marry with mother age woman etc done only for help of them. I will write a book a foolish people will be easily convinced & I declare in my book that you are prophet who can do any immoral act. & I will add in book many miracles done by you to make fool the people.

Mahmood March 21, 2011 At 8:15 pm

Shameless fellow agniveer and team,See modern science know 5 layers and for rest two you need to go back to Holy Quran.
It is the book of Miracles.Not like Krishna and Radha,Seductive duo or Ram Sita another seductive duo.
Quran can get all other creeds,religions out of gutter else no one can.Please read for more science only Quran.
PRay to Allah and his prophet(PBUH)

- KalBhairav March 21, 2011 At 8:35 pm
  
  @Mahmood:
  Chill bro. We are like the interviewers in this video while you are behaving like the interviewee.
  @Others:
  Look at this Madrassa-trained genius calling Quran the book of miracles in one paragraph and asking us to read the same for more science. 🙂
  
- Indian Agnostic March 21, 2011 At 9:43 pm
  
  Namaste Mahmood
  with every rebuttal , you are getting more and more abusive..which is good ..at least you know now that there is indeed some problem with “science” of the quran 🙂
  See modern science know 5 layers and for rest two you need to go back to Holy Quran.
  why make everybody wait for this great discovery? let me share with you the one of the atmospheric layer’s details as per the Quran.
  Quran 67:5
  “And we have, (from of old), adorned the lowest heaven with Lamps, and We have made such (Lamps) (as) missiles to drive away the Evil Ones, and have prepared for them the Penalty of the Blazing Fire. ”
  So according to Quran the lowest layer of earth’s atmosphere is filled with lamps(stars) and Allah shoots these stars at “evil ones”(jinns) as missiles!!!!! Science??? :))
  Mr. Mahmood, even when Science knows just 5 layers of earths atmosphere, it knows for sure that the first layer of earth’s atmosphere is not filled with Stars and that stars are not missiles to drive away jinns
  You may never wake up ..but being abusive doesnt serve any purpose ..does it?
  
- Vajra March 21, 2011 At 10:15 pm
  
  Namaste Mahamoodh 🙂
  ———–Pray to Allah AND HIS PROPHET (PBUH)———–
  Finally Islamic Tauheed is exposed! Pray to a pedophile in addition to Allah 🙂
  Can you tell me one thing Mahamoodh? Is Allah male or female?
  
  - Mahmood March 21, 2011 At 11:02 pm
    
    AllAh is omnipresent,omniscient and onmipotetent not male,female etc.Just pure bliss
  - sanatanaakki March 22, 2011 At 1:00 am
    
    Allah has definite shape coz he is sitting on his thrown above in heaven…
    and he made Adam by his own two hands….?
    its all written in quran… ..
    Are u saying quran says wrong?
- Aditya July 20, 2012 At 2:59 pm
  
  You are a typical muslim who abuses in a losing debate.Put yourself in a neutral position and see which makes more sense. You are biased and you just want to prove your point
  
sarang March 21, 2011 At 8:57 pm

namaste brothers,
is astrology derived from vedas? How authentic is horoscope? Is it true?

- Mahmood March 21, 2011 At 11:01 pm
  
  Sarang
  Please do read Vedas for Astrology and I assure for whole life you will keep on scratching your head.Simple answer if astrology is true then why Hindus could not save them from attacks and assault.They should have predicted it.
  Again bull shit astrology.
  Dirty and filthy fellow agniveer
  
Islam=non sense March 21, 2011 At 10:35 pm

I would like to post a video of a scientist who talked about science in the Quran.Can i post it?bcoz i have been posting too many videos here,i just want truth be told to these muslim fools.Agniveerji can i post the video here

- sanatanaakki March 22, 2011 At 1:01 am
  
  Plz do post it … we want to see more and more…
  We are truth seekers here…
  Agniveer ji only bans people who talk rubbish like Mahmood….
  
Mahmood March 21, 2011 At 10:56 pm

Shameles feellow agniveer and team.
It is written in quran that idol worhsippers will never understand and will go to hell.I can feel that why.
Basically Hindu genes are like that.Without sword they do not understand.You all are samheless creatures and this is not filthy language.
When ur own people talk about Radhey krishna and Krishna having fun with radaha then you do not feel wrong.
Well India is not able to produc single famous scientist and we don’t have to produce as everything is already described and invented in Quran by Muhammad sahab(PBUH).
Why world is discovering now was already revealed long back in QURAN.
ONe can never explain donkey or mule i.e what Hindu genes are.I am not using bad word but simply letting you all know that your genes are corrupt and they require sword.
Do you not know that finally Hindus are only 50Cr in India and rest have either become Mulim or Christians,Sikhs,Jains,Biddhist.What else you all require.One point of time world was following Vedic religion and now see the condition.You pathetic ,filthy people are still thinking some GOD will come and save you.This is the reason we culled you all on streets.
Imagine if you cowards were knowing real vedas then you would not have been killed like this or culled like this.Sahmess creature agniveer.You must reply to me .Why r u asking these small filthy viruses to reply.
I don’t like these dumb people so please you reply and answer my this question
“WHO IS RESPONSIBLE FOR PATHETIC CONDITION OF HINDUS”
DO REPLY AGNIVEER IF YOU HAVE LITTLE BIT OF SHAME AND I WILL START MY DEBATE FROM THERE>

- Indian Agnostic March 21, 2011 At 11:29 pm
  
  Mahmood ..enough of your comedy!
  if you debate in the forum like you do at your home..you may get banned. [did you get the satire?]
  Dharmic Nabel laureates in Science
  1.Hargobind Khorana
  2.Subrahmanyan Chandrasekhar
  3.Venkatraman ‘Venki’ Ramakrishnan
  4.Sir Chandrasekhara Venkata Raman
  Islamic Nobel Laureates in science
  1. Ahmed Zewail
  This site is not your home ..so communicate respectfully
  
  - Mahmood March 22, 2011 At 6:12 am
    
    Boss forget it,India is sold to britihsers by you Hindus and no one else,Well in home also we say truth not liars like you hindus who have sold their motherland to britishers and till date selling it to sonia.See how enuch hindus are.they know Sonia is killing them still not even one coward has guts to kill Sonia.Hindus – enuchs ,
    Take my words you all were brave people and great class but you all have been made coward by these Saints ion last few thousand years.See Buddha he came and gave injection of Love to all hindus and they became impotenet and then came idiot maahavir JHain another idiot who gave another impotency dose to you all and you all lost testacles.
    All Hindu saints bteach about Radhey shyam and ram sita.But these saints never teach about how krishna killed kansa for dharma.How Ram killed Ravana.They never teach you how to fight for dharma and give your life.
    You Hindus are nothing more then short circuited breed of sprems.
    I really appreciate Swami Dayanand who provided fire to corpses and if you all would have emulated Ram,Krishna,Dayanand or Any sikh gurur it might have changed the course of India.
    Shameless fellows and creature of agniveers forget about me if you have real balls and if you are true son of you mother go and kill sonia or manmohan.
    Crap talking about Muhammad Sahab(PBUH)
  - Vik March 22, 2011 At 6:41 am
    
    @Mahmood
    And people like you sold Pakistan to Talibanis and Laskhkar e Taibaa, this is why pakistanis are crying everyday now asking India to help them from the Taliban rule.
    We all know how big cowards Moghals and arab invaders were, so no need to talk about hindus, first look into your own history. Your so called arab/moghal role models were destroyed by people like Shiva Ji, Guru Gobind ji, Ranjit Singh, and many more.
    All of us on this site have already started to emulate ourselves as Ram and Krishna. Back then, it was Raavan and Kansa, today its Zakir Naik and the islamic conquest. So each one of us on this site will become a Ram, a Krishna, a Dayanand, a Ranjit Singh, a Shivaji, in order to fight this evil off. The war has begun, we have launched and will be launching our missiles of Vedic Truth which will be so powerful that it will not only destroy the false hood of islam but unlike regular missiles that get self destroyed, this one will remain present after eradicating all humans out of falsehood for eternity.
  - sanatanaakki March 22, 2011 At 9:13 pm
    
    Very well said vik bhai….
    Any person with eagerness to understand reality will understand that ISLAM is nothing but terrorist manual….
    Hard for madarsa qualified people to understand tough..
- identity crisis March 22, 2011 At 8:33 pm
  
  @Mahmud
  Tu mere dil ka baat cheen liya. All sains and prophets, like buddha and mahavir taught us to be cowads, and not to fight. And we should ollow real dharma like ram fought with ravana and krishna fought the mahabharata.
  Learning from you,
  Jai shri ram
  
Mahmood March 21, 2011 At 10:58 pm

Moreover forget Vedas,We do not have single person who can interpret them.I asked so many priest everyone has his own translation.Sometime I feel like killing then all.
Vedas are true books of confusion.Nothing clear,pure bulls shit men.
Moreover more then 3000 scriptures which no one can read ans still you claim Hinduism.
See Vedas are confused and from confusion comes confused scoeity whcih you all samhelless creatures are.
Filthy fellow.

Mahmood March 21, 2011 At 10:59 pm

Agni veeer a filthy fellow
It is no one except Dirty Hindus who have bought such a pathetic condition to india.
Dirty fellow agniveer and his filthy team

- even i cud be the next prophet... :) March 22, 2011 At 12:16 am
  
  @ mahmood….
  hello sir.. may i know where r u from????? u r a great debater i must say….so u mind telling more abt u so that i know who m i actually debating with and how intellectual this debate is goin to become?
  
- truth seeker March 22, 2011 At 12:53 pm
  
  @Mohmad
  yar what problem you have? If agniveer working like Ram, Krishana, Dayanand, Guru Gobind Sing, you are protesting. He is bringing truth before us and we all should grateful to Agniveer Ji. Friend, Once leave the religion think rationally. As I have also leave many things like bowing head before stone because stone is not God. God is everywhere equally. God love all the people equally nothing special like Mohamad. Everyone is Prophet of God whenever someone realized God.
  
- truth seeker March 22, 2011 At 12:57 pm
  
  Mahmood
  yar what problem you have? If agniveer working like Ram, Krishana, Dayanand, Guru Gobind Sing, you are protesting. He is bringing truth before us and we all should grateful to Agniveer Ji. Friend, Once leave the religion think rationally. As I have also leave many things like bowing head before stone because stone is not God. God is everywhere equally. God love all the people equally nothing special like Mohamad. Everyone is Prophet of God whenever someone realized God.
  
even i cud be the next prophet... :) March 22, 2011 At 12:29 am

hi everyone
i wud like to know wht the vedas and quran say abt creation and destruction of universe……… wrt science ofcourse…………..

- sanatanaakki March 22, 2011 At 1:03 am
  
  Do u want to know i will tell u what Quran says…
  i have a video…
  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2CHm2xigkBc
  watch the above video and understand… about islamic concept of God word…
  
- Mahmood March 22, 2011 At 3:47 am
  
  Brother why u all consider or try to relate evrything by science.If that is case then science will win and all scriptures are wrong.This is all falseness of Christianity and western religioon.Problem with hindus is they sold India to britishers and then they use bad about ISLAm.Even Zakir Naik is big idiot.
  Why u all do not focus on saving india and why u all have put yopurself in glitches of this agniveer dirty anf filthy fellow.
  Samhelss Hindus have sold this country
  
  - Maharana March 22, 2011 At 12:06 pm
    
    @ Mahmood
    why do muslims write prophet muhammad (pbuh) till today. i think, it is ‘peace be upon him’. Even after such a long time, he could not get peace. ha.ha.ha. Cant Allah give him peace till today. This is real islam. Islam can give only explosion, death, rape. All Islamic countries fighting with so called idolators and then fighting within themselves to declare number of korans and islam, no one knows which, to be real. Only the religion of Hinduism, Buddha and Mahavir can give eternal peace. Had prophet muhammad been a follower of any one of these, no one was required to write PBUH.
  - even i cud be the next prophet... :) March 22, 2011 At 2:56 pm
    
    @ mahmood
    u taking me wrong Mr. it was a genuine question. not asking u bcz i wanna criticize or something .. asked so that i cud increase my knowledge and verify wht Mr zakir and others are saying abt it all.
    and btw this forum relates to this subjaetc so i hav full right to ask something related to it… if u hav ne problem with such discussions than u r welcome to take ur ass out of here.
    *Why u all do not focus on saving india and why u all have put yopurself in glitches of this agniveer dirty anf filthy fellow.*
    well……..nothing can influence me and my thoughts bcz i hav a mind of my own unlike people like u who r blind enough to believe in things which r not even there.
    as far saving india is concerned…. india will be safe for ever… people (mughals and british) came and perished and we still live on. the biggest threat to india today is people within who want to change the original culture. and enforce their own ideologies onto it……. well i think its time for another bunch of people to perish. best example……… see the condition of pakistan today.. on it way to destruction.
    *Problem with hindus is they sold India to britishers and then they use bad about ISLAm.*
    if u r educated enough u shud well be aware of indian history but unfortunately u dont seem so (with incapability of brain to evolve) so let me enlighten u…. british came here for business but looking at the riches of indian subcontinent they became greedy and forced themself in to exploit the different resources of india…. but they were not as harmful to indian culture as the people before them.. u know wht i m talking abt. they too came here just to plunder and exploit the riches of indian subcontinent and with them came islam. they either converted or killed.dominated most of india… to become great indian emperors. but wht happened to them .. they perished. we as indian didnt hav to do much abt it.. it happened naturally. its law of nature to balance out everything..(good and bad deeds) .. we on teh other hand excepted everything that came to india and adopted it. thats the beauty of indian culture always evolving with time..
    its the proven fact in theory of evolution that those who evolve survive and those who refuse to evolve and stay unchanged……… perish.
    my appeal to all the people ( hindu or muslim is to change with time and survive otherwise nature will take its own course and destroy u.
  - Indian Agnostic March 22, 2011 At 4:09 pm
    
    Namaste even i cud be the next prophet… 🙂
    my appeal to all the people ( hindu or muslim is to change with time and survive otherwise nature will take its own course and destroy u.
    bingo! you said it!
    PS: Royal Mughals 2007 status update : http://ibnlive.in.com/news/inheritance-of-loss-for-last-mughals-kin/39427-3.html – rickshaw pullers, scrap dealers and other halaal professions 😉
  - sanatanaakki March 22, 2011 At 9:23 pm
    
    @ mahmood
    God u saying that we are relating everything to science??
    Open ur eyes man this is what u people claim about quran …
    there is limit of bullshitting…
- KalBhairav March 22, 2011 At 9:21 pm
  
  @EICBTNP:
  I tracked down a couple of websites for you.
  Link1 which seems to be derived from Link 2.
  I havent studied the details there myself but hopefully I think you can get some of your queries answered.
  
  - even i cud be the next prophet... :) March 23, 2011 At 12:49 am
    
    @ kalbhairav
    thanx bro…. but i already had this article.. lolzz
    it doesnt hav much but it was very interesting though..
    it surely proves that wht vedas hav in them goes beyond the world.. it universal… infact its multiversal… so i dont know why r we even trying to prove others that vedic books are gud enough…. wrt science ofcourse….
    but i need some concrete explaination to the concept of construction and destruction in vedas as well as quran.. i know one thing that as pper quran its the last time their is gonna be life. it doesnt believe in the concept of universal cycles. right… enlighten me more on this…..
  - KalBhairav March 23, 2011 At 9:10 am
    
    @EICBTNP:
    You wanted to know what the Vedas said about the creation/destruction of the universe, and I gave you a link that I thought dealt with that. You said you already had that link. It still does not satisfy you and now you want more “enlightenment” from me.
    In any case, (I am no expert on scientific/vedic cosmology) how will we prove/disprove reincarnation, karma, etc.? Are you trying to push for scientism?
    Personally, I am an agnostic theist.
    PS: I kinda get the feeling you are trying to set me up for something here…not that I mind. I am curious about where you are heading and I am willing to play along for a while 😉
  - even i cud be the next prophet... :) March 23, 2011 At 3:46 pm
    
    @ kal bhairav…
    lmao.. 🙂 🙂 🙂 no man u r thinking too much…. it was really a genuine query… i believe discussions can help share eachother’s knowledge and can surely help improve our understanding as a whole….
    so i aint setting u up for something bad except for a healthy discussion where i cud be greatly benefitted……….
    regards
Purushottam March 22, 2011 At 9:42 am

Mystery of 7 layers of Atmosphere and Quran:
Atmosphere does not have distinctly different layers like peels of onions. Whole atmosphere is one and same. However properties vary gradually with distance and hence different zones of atmosphere are conceptualized for ease of understanding.
So 7 or 5 or whatever number of layers is more of a convention rather than a truth. This is like the color spectrum which is considered to have 7 colors or 6 colors by different people. But in reality it is one single variation of light frequency appearing as difference in colors.
So if we talk of layer theory of atmosphere and if Quran be divine because it predicted 7 layers of atmosphere, then Quran is outdated now. Because today, scientists regard atmosphere to have more than 7 layers. Here are some of the names:
1. Exosphere
2. Thermosphere
3. Mesosphere
4. Stratosphere
5. Troposphere
6. Ionosphere (Actually three layers D, E,F)
7. Magnetosphere (Actually not part of Atmosphere)
(These 7 have been regarded as 7 layers predicted by Quran. Refer http://www.miraclesofthequran.com/scientific_19.html )
Now some more layers:
8. Stratopause
9. Mesopause
10. Ozone layer
11. Homosphere
12. Heterosphere
13. Tropopause
14. Peplosphere
15. Free Atmosphere
16. Protonosphere
17. Neutrosphere
What the foolish Islamic scientist did to conjure 7 layers is to borrow 5 layers as per temperature gradient and add one name of layer as per electrical gradient (ionosphere) and one as per magnetic properties (magnetosphere). And he conveniently ignored the rest of temperature gradients because they are taught not at basic school level but at senior level!
Next miracle please!

Islam=non sense March 22, 2011 At 1:01 pm

Here is the truth for ignorant muslims
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ClHuG880pqU&feature=player_embedded

AHMAD March 22, 2011 At 4:13 pm

In 31:29, Allah says,
“Have you not seen how God merges the night into the day and merges the day into the night?” [31:29] [also see 3:27, 22:61, 35:13, 57:6]
The key word in 31:29 is “yooliju”. The root of the word “yooliju” is W-L-J. From the same root there is a word, “WOLUJUN”, which means a bend, or a place of bending, of a valley. When you walk on a place of bending of a valley, you see the horizon changing steadily, in front of your eyes. According to 31:29, the night changes into the day steadily as you see horizon changing steadily in front of your eyes, when you walk upon a place of bending of a valley. So, the change of day and night according to 31:29 give the idea of earth being NOT FLAT.
In 39:5, Allah says,
“…He coils the night upon the day and He coils the day upon the night…” 39:5
The key word in 39:5 is “yukawwiru”. The primary signification of the root of the word “yukawwiru” is “to wind a thing in a round form”, like e.g. a turban is wound round a head. This verse 39:5, again gives the idea of the earth being roundish and not FLAT.
In 79:30, Allah says,
[Transliteration] Waal-arda baAAda thalika dahaha [79:30]
The key word in the above verse is “dahaha”. In Arabic, there is a phrase, “iza dahaha” which means “when he throws the stones over the ground to the hole”. The hole is called “Udhiyatun”. “Almadahi” signify round stones according to the size of which a hole is dug in the ground in which the stones are thrown in a game. “Almadahi” also signify a round thing made of lead by the throwing of which persons contend together. So there is a signification of ROUNDNESS in the root of the word “dahaha”. According to some etymologists, the word for the “egg of an ostrich” also has the same root as “dahaha”. They also take from this that the earth is of the shape of the egg of an ostrich. Latest science findings confirm that the earth is not exactly spherical but the earth is an ellipsoid, i.e. flattened by its poles,[ just like the shape of an egg of an ostrich].
The Arabic words for “flat” or “level” or “straight shaped” are “sawi” and “almustavi”. There is not a single place in Quran where there is any indication of the earth being “flat” or “straight shaped”. The word “faraash” in 2:22, 51:48; the word “wasia” in 4:97, 29:56, 30:10; the word “mahd” in 20:53, 43:10, 78:6; the word “basaat” in 71:19; the word “suttihat” in 88:20; and the word “tahaaha” in 91:6, all may mean, “to spread”, “to expand” or “to extend” with slight differences in their connotations but none signify the earth being straight-shaped or flat.
EXAMPLES
دحا (daha): ROUND and SPHERICAL:
إندحَّ بطنه إندحاحاّ اي إتّسع His tummy became round and bigger.
In Prophet Muhammad’s Hadith: كان لأسامة بطننٌ مُندحٌ اي متسع Osama had a round and big tummy.
و بطنٌ مُنداحُ أي خارخٌ مُدوّر His tummy is mun-daahun means it is OUT THERE AND ROUND مُدوّر.
و رجلٌّ دحدحُ اي قصير غليظ البطن A man is dahda-hun which means he is short, stocky and has a big and fat tummy.
الدحداح هو المستدير الململم The dahdaah is the person who is ROUND and STOCKY.

- Indian Agnostic March 22, 2011 At 6:46 pm
  
  Namaste AHMAD
  (*your comments in italics, emphasis mine)
  In 31:29, Allah says,
  “Have you not seen how God merges the night into the day and merges the day into the night?” [31:29] [also see 3:27, 22:61, 35:13, 57:6]
  The key word in 31:29 is “yooliju”. The root of the word “yooliju” is W-L-J. From the same root there is a word, “WOLUJUN”, which means a bend, or a place of bending, of a valley. When you walk on a place of bending of a valley, you see the horizon changing steadily, in front of your eyes. According to 31:29, the night changes into the day steadily as you see horizon changing steadily in front of your eyes, when you walk upon a place of bending of a valley. So, the change of day and night according to 31:29 give the idea of earth being NOT FLAT.
  Please focus on the bold part of your statement.It shows that your explanation is not honest 🙁
  What you have done sir is that you go to the root of the word “yooliju” and arbitrarily picked up another word from this common root.Why on earth and with what logic you can do that?
  you commit a great blunder by assuming that all words arising of the same root are somehow interchangeable ….Do you know that “Islam” shares the same root as “saleem” and a “derivative of salaama”.
  if i go by your logic, Islam (a religion) = Saleem( a man who has submitted) = a derivative of slaama( sting of snake bite or tanning of leather) – do all of these three words become the same just because they share a common root
  Is there some sting of snake bite in Islam? Is Islam a Man? Saleem =Islam? does Saleem bite like a snake?
  If your answer is No( which it must be logically) , then you would have understood how dishonest your arbitrary replacement of one word with another is.
  In short , Just because two words share the same root they don’t mean the same thing
  In 39:5, Allah says,
  “…He coils the night upon the day and He coils the day upon the night…” 39:5
  The key word in 39:5 is “yukawwiru”. The primary signification of the root of the word “yukawwiru” is “to wind a thing in a round form”, like e.g. a turban is wound round a head. This verse 39:5, again gives the idea of the earth being roundish and not FLAT.
  again sir, you are playing dangerously with words (Does Islam = Saleem = Salaama just because they share the same root ? )
  why don;pt you learn from the reputed reputed Islamic scholars who have translated this word:
  Quran 39:5
  source: http://www.usc.edu/schools/college/crcc/engagement/resources/texts/muslim/quran/039.qmt.html#039.005
  YUSUFALI: He created the heavens and the earth in true (proportions): He makes the Night overlap the Day, and the Day overlap the Night: He has subjected the sun and the moon (to His law): Each one follows a course for a time appointed. Is not He the Exalted in Power – He Who forgives again and again?
  PICKTHAL: He hath created the heavens and the earth with truth. He maketh night to succeed day, and He maketh day to succeed night, and He constraineth the sun and the moon to give service, each running on for an appointed term. Is not He the Mighty, the Forgiver?
  SHAKIR: He has created the heavens and the earth with the truth; He makes the night cover the day and makes the day overtake the night, and He has made the sun and the moon subservient; each one runs on to an assigned term; now surely He is the Mighty, the great Forgiver.
  None of the scholars translate it as you do.The only thing coiled sir , is your argument
  In 79:30, Allah says, [Transliteration] Waal-arda baAAda thalika dahaha [79:30]
  The key word in the above verse is “dahaha”. In Arabic, there is a phrase, “iza dahaha” which means “when he throws the stones over the ground to the hole”.
  Great! does anybody sense anything spherical in that statement apart from the statement? No!
  The hole is called “Udhiyatun”.
  bingo! now we jump from dahaha to undhiyatun, which unfortunately means a HOLE ! Despite this twist in the story..anything spherical here? No( Yes! the argument of course !)
  “Almadahi” signify round stones according to the size of which a hole is dug in the ground in which the stones are thrown in a game. “Almadahi” also signify a round thing made of lead by the throwing of which persons contend together.
  wow! now we have a new friend “Almadahi” ..anything spherical here? NO! [ those who said yes twice are losers ..even circles are round. Congratulations to those who said yes once(for the argument is not round it’s gone spherical 😉 ]
  So there is a signification of ROUNDNESS in the root of the word “dahaha”. According to some etymologists, the word for the “egg of an ostrich” also has the same root as “dahaha” . They also take from this that the earth is of the shape of the egg of an ostrich. Latest science findings confirm that the earth is not exactly spherical but the earth is an ellipsoid, i.e. flattened by its poles,[ just like the shape of an egg of an ostrich].
  Here is where Mr. Ahmad shines in full glory ..he does not treat the meaning of dahaha as most etymologists do ..but he takes the opinion of some etymologists that dahaha could also mean ostrich’s egg .How scientific Dr. Ahmad !
  if some people say Islam is false and most people say islam is true ..I guess Dr. Ahmad would be ready to leave Islam as he is more amenable to minority opinion
  The Arabic words for “flat” or “level” or “straight shaped” are “sawi” and “almustavi”. There is not a single place in Quran where there is any indication of the earth being “flat” or “straight shaped”. The word “faraash” in 2:22, 51:48; the word “wasia” in 4:97, 29:56, 30:10; the word “mahd” in 20:53, 43:10, 78:6; the word “basaat” in 71:19; the word “suttihat” in 88:20; and the word “tahaaha” in 91:6, all may mean, “to spread”, “to expand” or “to extend” with slight differences in their connotations but none signify the earth being straight-shaped or flat.
  EXAMPLES
  دحا (daha): ROUND and SPHERICAL:
  إندحَّ بطنه إندحاحاّ اي إتّسع His tummy became round and bigger.
  In Prophet Muhammad’s Hadith: كان لأسامة بطننٌ مُندحٌ اي متسع Osama had a round and big tummy.
  و بطنٌ مُنداحُ أي خارخٌ مُدوّر His tummy is mun-daahun means it is OUT THERE AND ROUND مُدوّر.
  و رجلٌّ دحدحُ اي قصير غليظ البطن A man is dahda-hun which means he is short, stocky and has a big and fat tummy.
  الدحداح هو المستدير الململم The dahdaah is the person who is ROUND and STOCKY.
  Instead of already debunked twists and turns …do one thing sir ..Show me one place in the Quran where it says unequivocally that the earth is spherical ..round can also mean a circle and the same root can give words of different meanings.
  And by replacing the original word with other betterwords in your explanation you have proved just one thing ..that either you have a better word than quran to prove it;s meaning OR The author of quran had a limited vocabulary
  I hope to learn from you, if you find any of my rebuttals unscientific
  best regards
  
  - Vajra March 22, 2011 At 8:59 pm
    
    Namaste Brother Indian Agnostic
    Still laughing at, Islam = snake bite 🙂
    Seems his logic has hit the right target mistakenly 😉
    Great reply!
  - Indian Agnostic March 22, 2011 At 10:25 pm
    
    Namaste Brother Vajra
    I hope Mr Ahmad stops falling prey to logic-deficient propagandist arguments…i sincerely do
even i cud be the next prophet... :) March 22, 2011 At 9:00 pm

@ ahmad
u r a funny guy …. and i cud even call u a genius for ur ability to prove something which doesnt exist.
plzzzz plzzzzz plzzzzzzz let quran be a holy book … and dont try to mix it with science otherwise people of ur faith will start dropping out of schools and start reading such stuff even more ….. which, hope everyone agress with me, wud surely take muslim people even more backward in time and make them even more illiterate…. which wud further lead to more poverty and joblessness and than more people will began to follow terrorist activities to earn some easy money or will become more fanatic.
@indian agnostic
well it seems u have a awnser for everythin……. i think no muslim bhayee is gonna awnser the question i asked instead they wud post some vedio links as if these links too have been recommended straight by the god. hope u cud enlighten me on wht i asked.

- Indian Agnostic March 22, 2011 At 10:20 pm
  
  Namaste @even i cud be the next prophet… 🙂
  and what was that question sir? [ not that i wud knw the answr , but i’ll try to co-discover along with you]
  
  - even i cud be the next prophet... :) March 23, 2011 At 2:40 pm
    
    @indian agnostic
    my query was abt the concept construction and destruction of universe in both vedas and quran.
    the reason i wanna know this is that wen i was a kid i read few books like ‘sukh sagar’ and some puran.. dont remember much abt wht i read as i was just aroung 10. but do remember few things abt the way universe was created bcz i found it very interesting and scientific and hav always been comparing it with the modern science….
    and u r right lets co discover it since u r well acquanted with vedic and quranic concepts and i m not. hope its a healthy discussion.
    regards.
  - Vajra March 23, 2011 At 4:01 pm
    
    Namaste even i cud be the next prophet…
    You can read Satyarth Prakash by Swami Dayanand in this regard, specially its 8th chapter.
    thanks
  - Indian Agnostic March 23, 2011 At 4:11 pm
    
    Namaste even i cud be the next prophet… 🙂
    It is claimed that the theory of creation of the universe is found in nasadiya sukta of rig veda.(10th manadala, hymn 129)
    well quran’s story of creation is evident from the article itself.
    hope its a healthy discussion.
    Trust me , i am an agnostic and we agree on many things than you realize 🙂
Muhammad March 22, 2011 At 9:29 pm

Ahmad bhai Please do not try to explain them they are brain washed .Inki Kaum hi gandi hai.Haram hai inko samjhana.

- sanatanaakki March 22, 2011 At 9:38 pm
  
  @ Muhmaad..
  Ur going against the word of Allah again…
  its ur duty to make others understand what Islam is….
  and ur saying hinduo ko samjhana Haram hai??
  U want to burn in hell??
  
- Indian Agnostic March 23, 2011 At 8:14 am
  
  Namaste @Muhammad
  Aray mian ..tum yahaan padhe likhe logon ki jamaat mein kahaan bhatak rahe ho ?
  yahaan pe aapki baat sirf isliye nahi maan li jayegi ki aap badzubaan ho ..ab aapke ghar ka dastoor har jagah to laagoo nahi ho sakta na 🙂
  
- hardcorehindu April 13, 2011 At 12:14 pm
  
  WTF dude…are you on drugs? I have read all your posts and you seem to have no logic in what you write. India doesnt have scientists….? Really? Have you attended school? Do they teach science in Madrasas?
  
- Rj3865 May 14, 2011 At 4:55 am
  
  Brother mahmood ,
  they way u explained ahmad that hinduism is haram is wat u are taught in Quran that when you are unable to defeat the truth and peace left in world , then attack him with abusive language or wirh sword ..
  See watever u are saying is just to satisfy you but kindly listen to your heart which says Islam is most voilent and false religion spreading terror throughout the world , this is wat Quran stands for . You know why Muslims try to defend or spread islam throughout world b’coz u guys are the most insecured from within and think that if whole world accepts islam then no one will stand to critisize it , Plz grow up and understand that its all b’coz of Quran u r not accepting that u are defeated and instead abusing the one who is showing you true path.. Hope so you realize very soon and follow the very true VEDAS for a good peaceful life ..
  
sanatanaakki March 22, 2011 At 9:39 pm

@ Everyone ….
Guys please sign this petition …. and save this saint from the clutches of our prostitute congress govt…
sign this if you feel appropriate:
Save the Hindu Woman Saint Sadhvi Prgya Thakur
http://www.change.org/petitions/save-the-hindu-woman-saint-sadhvi-prgya-thakur-from-the-indian-government
This is pure injustice. Narco-tests were administered on her four times. The reason for her detention is even faint. Just her sold scooter was found outside the blast site.
While Kasab is being royally treated with biryanis, our Sanyasin is being treated shabbily with violation of every human right. Of course,the leftist media human rights group won’t raise a whimper when it comes to a Hindu woman saint.
Please sign the petition “Save the Hindu Woman Saint Sadhvi Prgya Thakur From the Indian Government ” and help by adding your name.
Our goal is to reach 100,000 signatures and we need more support.
You can sign the petition here:
http://www.change.org/petitions/save-the-hindu-woman-saint-sadhvi-prgya-thakur-from-the-indian-government?share_source=share-petition_em&ue=sei

Rushmore March 22, 2011 At 10:31 pm

Zakir Naik & his ilk epitomize the Stockholm syndrome. The progeny of those that were enslaved by the desert dwellers are today the flag bearers of the same faith. The standard response to this will be to claim “Hey I am not a Muslim because I was born in a Muslim family but I am a Muslim by choice.” Since when did Muslims start having choices?? If Muslims have a choice, you will not have religious police hoarding people into mosques for prayers. Fo this the standard response is to claim” Don’t judge Islam by what is happening in Riyadh.” But the same guy will have a sticker of a sword and two palm trees pasted on his vehicle. Afterall the enslaved cultists think that the blood of the Quraish and establishing some linkage to he Quarish is hep. Bigots are like the retina of the eyes. The more light you pour, the more they contract.

Refuting Agniveer – Moon Splitting Miracle | muhammedtheprophet March 29, 2011 At 11:48 pm

[…] This article is in response to Agniveers article http://agniveer.com/3902/science-zakir/ […]

Mansoor March 31, 2011 At 2:19 pm

Quran and Science
Quran says in Surah 51 verse 47 that our universe is expanding.
“It is we who have built the universe with [our creative] power; and, verily, it is we who are steadily expanding it.”(Muhammad Asad)
And we know that it was Edvin Hubbel who discovered that universe is expanding.
Further Quran says in Surah 21 verse 30:
30.ARE, THEN, they who are bent on denying the truth not aware that the heavens and the earth were [once] one single entity, which We then parted asunder? – and [that] We made out of water every living thing? Will they not, then, [begin to] believe?(Muhammad Asad)
Imam Muhammad ibn Jarir al-Tabari quoted Ibn ‘Abbas – the Companion of the Last Prophet of Islam Muhammad ,that the heavens and the earth were united and joined together.
George Gamow presented this notion on mathematical bases and large number of scientific observations has been supporting this Qur’anic narrative.
George Gamow was a Russian-born theoretical physicist and cosmologist.
Further Muhammad Asad said in his commentary of Surah 21 verse 30:
“…Nevertheless, the above unmistakable reference to the unitary origin of the universe – metonymically described in the Qur’an as “the heavens and the earth” – strikingly anticipates the view of almost all modern astrophysicists that this universe has originated as one entity from one single element, namely; hydrogen, which became subsequently consolidated through gravity and then separated into individual nebulae, galaxies and solar systems, with further individual parts progressively breaking away to form new entities in the shape of stars, planets and the latters’ satellites.”

- Rushmore March 31, 2011 At 3:04 pm
  
  @ Mansoor: Please get over this ZN conditioning. In Arabic, please point me to the word that actually DOES mention “Expanding.”
  Surah 51:47
  YUSUFALI: With power and skill did We construct the Firmament: for it is We Who create the VASTNESS of pace.
  PICKTHAL: We have built the heaven with might, and We it is Who make the VAST extent (thereof).
  SHAKIR: And the heaven, We raised it high with power, and most surely We are the makers of things AMPLE.
  Any 7th century Arab knew that theuniverse is VAST. Where is the science in Surah 51:47?? And like I said please point us to the Arabic word in the verse that means EXPANDING.
  This verse which supposedly oozes with science has been refuted many times but ZN keeps repeating the lie.
  
  - Mansoor March 31, 2011 At 11:04 pm
    
    To Rushmore
    Why you quoted only three translations?Let me quote others:
    Surah 51:47
    ” With Our power and prowess, We brought into being the universe. And indeed, We expand it (steadily)!”(Dr.Munir Munshey)
    “And it is We Who have built the Universe, and behold, We are steadily expanding it.”(Shabbir Ahmed)
    “And the heaven, We have constructed it mightily, and it is surely We Who have vast power, and keep expanding it.”(Ali Unal)
    Maulana Maududi says in his “Tafhim al-Quran” (The Meaning of the Quran) about Surah 51:47:
    (51:47) And heaven – We made it with Our Own Power and We have the Power to do so.
    Commentary by Maulana Maududi:
    “The word must’ (pl. musi’un) may mean the one who possesses power and means, and also the one who can extend and expand something. According to the first meaning, the verse would mean: “We have built this heaven by Our own might and not with somebody else’s help, and its erection was in no way beyond Us. Then how can you ever conceive that We shall not be able to recreate it ?” According to the second meaning, it would mean: “This huge universe that We have created, is not a finished work, but We are expanding it continuously, and new and ever new manifestations of Our creation are appearing in it every moment. How do you then think that such a marvelous Creator would not be able to repeat His creation.”
    Note:Maulana Maududi was a Sunni Pakistani journalist, theologian, Muslim revivalist leader and political philosopher, and a major 20th century Islamist thinker.
    For indepth studies:Click
    http://islamic-replies.ucoz.com/2/Expanding_Universe.html
  - Rushmore April 1, 2011 At 12:11 am
    
    @ Mansoor: Hmm, you are now depending on a Maulana from Pakistan to explain a verse from the Quran. So, the Quran by itself is difficult (for you)to explain the verse If you do not agree with the 3 of the most famous authorities on Quran and Quranic translation, then you are jeopardizing the whole Quran. How can anybody trust the Quran in English, if you disagree with YUSUFALI, PICKTHAL and SHAKIR? How can 3 translators be wrong about one word?
    And you cornered yourself. Based on your reference, each Quranic verse has 2 meanings? The first time one reads it, 51:47 will mean that they (Allah & Muhammad?) built the universe with their power and when the verse is read for the second time, the meaning will be that the universe is expanding?
    Excellent!! So, this is how one needs to interpret the Quran?
  - Mansoor April 1, 2011 At 1:13 am
    
    I suggest you to click the following links to read little a bit about it:
    http://islamic-replies.ucoz.com/2/Expanding_Universe.html
    http://www.bismikaallahuma.org/archives/2005/does-musiun-means-expanding/
  - Indian Agnostic April 1, 2011 At 9:23 am
    
    Namaste Mansoor Bro
    The problem with Quranic Science is that it has too many errors.Not all can be shielded by innovative re-interpretations.
    For example,
    1) The Heaven(which you call Universe) of Quran is a solid thingy ! it’s pieces fall from sky according to Allah 🙁
    Quran 52:44
    YUSUFALI: Were they to see a piece of the sky falling (on them), they would (only) say: “Clouds gathered in heaps!”
    PICKTHAL: And if they were to see a fragment of the heaven falling, they would say: A heap of clouds.
    2)The heaven(your universe) is not expanding ..for it were expanding ..one would need an expanding ladder to reach heaven. Allah is not building the case of an expanding heaven when he says this:
    Quran 52:38
    YUSUF ALI: Or have they a ladder, by which they can (climb up to heaven and) listen (to its secrets)? Then let (such a) listener of theirs produce a manifest proof.
    PICKTHALL: Or have they any stairway (unto heaven) by means of which they overhear (decrees). Then let their listener produce some warrant manifest!
    There are many more examples..but i hope these will suffice
    Dhanyawad
  - roger April 3, 2011 At 12:40 pm
    
    hah, he(afridi) asks to media why we hate Indians? well, ask your maulana’s, your cult teaches only hatred. come back home, brother.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dfmKZd568b8
  - Rj3865 May 14, 2011 At 11:19 pm
    
    Brother Mansoor ,
    I have a question for all Islamic scholars and great scientist like you , that why all of you can’t use the actual meaning of the word in Arabic quoted in any verse of Quran?
    Why you just try to prove science in Quran by imposing several meanings of a single word or by any method you guys connect the Arabic word with any word which is beat suitable to prove science in Quran?
    What do you think that when Quran was revealed to Prophet Muhammad (P.B.U.H) by ALLAH , ALLAH must have told him several meanings of a single word to prophet so that people of later time can relate Glorious Quran with science , I don’t think so ..
    You do this because if you use the actual meaning of all Arabic words in any language translation then it will be proved that Quran contains error and is not revealed by God ….
Rushmore March 31, 2011 At 3:09 pm

@ Mansoor: And I am not sure you looked up 21:30 correctly. Surah 21 Verse 30 talks about heaven and earth being together and WE (Allah + Muhammad?) cloved them asunder. Where does the verse talk about water,as you had mentioned?

- Rushmore March 31, 2011 At 3:14 pm
  
  And many times, it as been exposed that 21:30 ties back directly to Genesis 1: 6 – 9. So don’t you think that the credit should be given to the Bible instead of Quran, as many experts of comparitive religions have said?
  
  - Mansoor April 1, 2011 At 12:22 am
    
    But Genesis accounts contradict with Big Bang Theory.For example:
    God created the earth before the sun and stars(Genesis 1:1-5) However, the big-bang view teaches the exact opposite.
    Genesis teaches that God created the universe in six days.It is clear from the context in Genesis that these were days in the ordinary sense (i.e., 24-hour days) since they are bounded by evening and morning and occur in an ordered list (second day, third day, etc.).Conversely, the big bang teaches the universe has evolved over billions of years.
  - Rushmore April 1, 2011 At 9:48 am
    
    @ Mansoor: Do you know how the big bang theory happened? If anything, both the Bible and the Quran are wrong,when the verses are used to make a connection with the Big Bang theory. It is your enthusiasm to make the Quran look scientific that is driving you to link Q 21:30 to the Big Bang. If the big bang is true then Quran 21:30 is wrong. Period. Here is why…
    ” The theory of the Big Bang stipulates that about 13.7 billion years ago a tremendous explosion started the universe. Prior to that event all of the energy that was later transformed into matter was contained at one infinitely small point (not nebula). This explosion, not only gave birth to the particles that gave birth to the matter, but also to space and time.
    The Big Bang actually consisted of an explosion of space within itself unlike an explosion of a bomb were fragments are thrown outward. The galaxies were not all clumped together, but rather the Big Bang lay the foundations for the universe. Therefore the notion of “separating the heaven and the earth” is meaningless.
    Furthermore, how can this tiny planet of ours be separate from the universe? Our Earth is a planet of one of the billions of galaxies that comprise the universe. In the following photo you can see a small portion of the universe. The galaxies are scattered everywhere. Each galaxy contains several hundred billion stars. The earth is a planet revolving around one of the stars that comprise our galaxy, known as The Milky Way. Where is the separation between the heavens and the Earth?” ”
    The above paragraphs are based on rebuttals given by someone that knows both the Big Bang and the Quran weel enough.
    21:30 presents also another problem. It contradicts with the verse 41.11. “Moreover He comprehended in His design the sky, and it had been (as) smoke: He said to it and to the earth: “Come ye together, willingly or unwillingly.” They said: “We do come (together), in willing obedience.”
    So which story is the right tale of the creation? Were the heaven and the earth joined together and Allah clove them asunder or were they apart and Allah told them to come together?
  - Rushmore April 1, 2011 At 9:55 am
    
    @ Mansoor: If you think that the days in which this universe was created in the Bible is wrong, the same error exists in the Quran too. Ofcourse, Zakir Naik, having realized that this will be troublesome to explain,rehashed the 7 days of the Quran into epochs to make it look like the Quran talks about the Big Bang.
    Mansoor, please explain how come you derive a conclusion that the Biblical “days” of creation are just days but that the Quranic days of creation are epochs. Where is it mentioned so in the Quran??
- Mansoor March 31, 2011 At 11:45 pm
  
  To Rushmore
  Here are translations of Surah 21 verse 30:
  Do the unbelievers not consider the fact that the heavens and the earth were joined together? We split them asunder! And from water, We created every living being! Do they not believe (that)
  (Dr.Munir Munshey)
  Do not the Unbelievers see that the heavens and the earth were joined together (as one unit of creation), before we clove them asunder? We made from water every living thing. Will they not then believe?(Yusuf Ali)
  Have not those who disbelieve known that the heavens and the earth were joined together as one united piece, then We parted them? And We have made from water every living thing. Will they not then believe? (Muhammad Al-Hilali & Muhsin Khan)
  Do not those who disbelieve see that the heavens and the earth were closed up, but We have opened them; and We have made of water everything living, will they not then believe?(Shakir)
  Do not the disbelievers see that the heavens and the earth were a closed up-mass, then WE opened them out ? And WE made of water every living thing. Will they not then believe ?(Sher Ali)
  Do not those who misbelieve see that the heavens and the earth were both solid, and we burst them asunder; and we made from water every living thing – will they then not believe?(Palmer)
  Have not the unbelievers then beheld that the heavens and the earth were a mass all sewn up, and then We unstitched them and of water fashioned every living thing? Will they not believe?(Arberry)
  Have not those who disbelieve known that the heavens and the earth were of one piece, then We parted them, and we made every living thing of water ? Will they not then believe ?(Pickthall)
  Do not the unbelievers therefore know, that the heavens and the earth were solid, and We clave the same in sunder; and made every living thing of water? Will they not therefore believe?(Sale)
  Do not the infidels see that the heavens and the earth were both a solid mass, and that we clave them asunder, and that by means of water we give life to everything? Will they not then believe?(Rodwell)
  All the above translators are talking about that every living thing is made by water.
  And by the way “We” never mean “Allah + Muhammad”.Prophet Muhammad is not the creator.Only Allah is.Prophet Muhammad is only a servant of Allah.
  
108Eternal March 31, 2011 At 7:40 pm

Namaste brothers and sisters.
Can brother Rushmore or anyone else for that matter shed some light on the activities of the Arya Samaj in Arunachal Pradesh? I know that my question is off-topic, but I would really like to know if the Arya Samaj are dealing with the christian missionaries who as I read on Wikipedia are operating there.

- Rushmore March 31, 2011 At 10:21 pm
  
  @ 108 Eternal: I will not be the right person to answer you what Arya Samaj is doing in Arunachal Pradesh. But I can share with you whatever I know about what’s called the Joshua Project. It involves an extremely rigorous gameplan by an umbrella of evangelical organizations to proselytize those countries that fall between 10 degree and 40 degree N of Latitude. They call it the 10/40 window. India falls right in the middle of it. Information is power. Try to know more at http://www.joshuaproject.net. And recently, the Indian Govt silently removed the act in our constitution that prevents missionaries from going to certain tribal districts in India’s North East. Courtesy:Madamme Sonia….
  
  - 108Eternal April 1, 2011 At 1:28 pm
    
    Namaste brother.
    Thank you so much. It seems that the christian evangelicals go about in a much more planned and organised manner than the jihadi muslim evangelicals. It’s truly disgusting to see that such organisations are allowed to exist, but then again, radical evangelism is one of the main features of abrahamic cults such as christianity. All it does is fill me with even more disgust for these cults.
    The people of Bharat need to wisen up and bring the BJP to power instead of this group of Adharmic people known as the congress.
    One other thing brother, could you please tell me to what extent Vedic organisations are fighting these evangelicals? Have the Vedic organisations been successful in driving these people away?
  - Rushmore April 2, 2011 At 12:02 am
    
    @ 108 Eternal: I think the challenge to evangelism is coming from localized groups and specific organizations like Art Of Living and Esha Foundation and ofcourse Arya Samaj, VHP / RSS. For example, AOL has a seperate Arunachal Pradesh wing that spread the message of the Dharma.
Mahmood April 1, 2011 At 7:31 pm

Arya Samaj Fraud exposed
Vedic-Dharm & Islam – 1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PJG94AwJLK4&feature=related
Vedic-Dharm & Islam – 3
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_LOtg18wHxQ&feature=related
Vedic-Dharm & Islam – 4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u3nYolUUcLI&feature=related
Vedic-Dharm & Islam – 5
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RAF9B_48jY8&feature=related
Vedic-Dharm & Islam – 6
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fpVKWdtGxJo&feature=related
Vedic-Dharm & Islam – 7(1)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r25xEQ73ynY&feature=related
Vedic-Dharm & Islam – 7(2)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UT_8PL3pshI&feature=related
Vedic-Dharm & Islam – 7(3)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4eV2fB9NHaQ&feature=related
Vedic-Dharm & Islam – 14
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9wfseFZpJYQ&feature=related

- sanatanaakki April 1, 2011 At 7:38 pm
  
  @ Mahmood
  why are u missing the point and raising other questions… stick to the topic and complete one thing then bring other…
  Like this we all will keep on posting questions and no one will answer….
  
- 108Eternal April 1, 2011 At 8:04 pm
  
  Namaste brother.
  The following videos show how Mahendra Pal Arya of the Arya Samaj defeats abdullah tariq (zakir naik’s guru) and it is proven Vedas are the true divine texts, with abdullah tariq admitting it too:
  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QZ-JCt24nFE
  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g-DkJHDouMM
  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F5jD3GPcOjw
  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jRClI4Od7iY
  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vRnTF4S7HUc
  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J3sTBngk23I
  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LvDaA7y0iXI
  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BI35rz8yoH4
  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Foh93VDc3U
  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-kMrtHysS2w
  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HNiigNbDWsc
  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bea9rfqI2vA
  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4zSnpG3s7U4
  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iTZVffs6hsE
  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VomLEZakHuI
  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZZOsCzTMtYM
  Educate yourself brother.
  
  - Renny April 3, 2011 At 12:43 am
    
    Please would someone translate this into English
    or give subtitles?
    Thank you
    Renny
  - sanatanaakki April 3, 2011 At 1:53 am
    
    Many people have asked the same but… its not yet done….
    We hope some day we get the exact translation of the debate….
  - Satyendra April 3, 2011 At 12:30 pm
    
    Hi Brother Pathans,
    It is very interesting to know that Islam has always been biased towards Madarsas and not towards rational thinkings.
    These centers brainwash people so that they focus only on ISLAM. We as human beings have every right to look towards our history and cultural linkages. For example: Pakthas [Now called as Pathans], were the eminent leaders in saving the vedic practices from infiltrators since 2 Millennium BC.
    Pathans were the warrior class who fought against these so called peaceful people. However, they have ethical standards which led to them being overpowered by these peaceful people. Pathans can be considered as the Kshatrias [Rajputs] who had a good spirit to defend their land, resources and people. This quality is still in their blood.
    Even Vedic Literature proves that Pakthas [Pathans] were in Afghanistan region till Rajesthan India]. Pathans are our brothers and nowhere Islamic from blood. Though they have become violent because of some dirty minds exploiting them, but still they are our brothers. I salute Pakthas[Pathans] for defending Indian Social system for many centuries.
    They have sacrificed many lives which at the end resulted in their mass conversion. This does not mean that we do not consider them as Indians. They still have Vedic linkage in their roots and blood.
    Agniveer has helped me in identifying the Indian roots from all over the world. I request everyone to give respect to Pathans as they have deep affiliation with Vedic-System.
    I hope my Paktha [Pathan] brothers who are viewing this thread would search their roots in the historical events and not Quran. My thanks to all the Pathans, once again !
    Regards,
    Satyendra
AHMAD April 4, 2011 At 4:50 pm

Response :Moon Light in The Noble Qur’an
http://www.islamhinduism.com/responses/answering-agniveer/77-moon-light-in-noble-quran

- KalBhairav April 4, 2011 At 4:58 pm
  
  @AHMAD:
  If I take the trouble of registering on that website, I am unsure you guys will allow me to post rebuttals there without moderation…
  In any case, here is a youtube channel debunking *ALL ISLAMIC MIRACLES/SCIENCE CLAIMS*. They also have a section dedicated to Zakir Naik. Congrats Bro, Zakir Naik is now achieving world-wide fame that even non-Hindus and non-Indians are making videos about him!!!
  
  - AHMAD April 4, 2011 At 5:07 pm
    
    @KALBHAIRAV….
    We do not delete any comments unless they are abusive and lack basic decency unlike agniveer who deletes the comments of Muslims but retains the abusive and slanderous comments of Hindu radicals.
  - KalBhairav April 4, 2011 At 5:10 pm
    
    @AHMAD:
    Alrighty then…I will register if I feel like it later. In the meantime, here is a challenge for you. Get to work, my dear friend 😉
  - hardcorehindu April 13, 2011 At 12:18 pm
    
    @ Ahmad
    Please check what the illiterate Mr. Muhammad has written in this article. Check all his unscientific, baseless and illogical arguements. He still isnt banned here. We want more and more of such people to write so that when a 3rd person reads this post he can decide for himself who the better person is.
    @ Muhammad
    Dear friend, why have you stopped entertaining us?
  - sanatanaakki April 4, 2011 At 5:11 pm
    
    @ KalBhairav
    Y u even care to ask.. you know how biased these people are they will answer u some big verses and ban u and display as u accepted the defeat …
    HARI OM..
  - KalBhairav April 4, 2011 At 5:16 pm
    
    @sanatanaakki:
    Indeed. They deal with apostates by killing them. That shows their intellectual maturity.
  - AHMAD April 4, 2011 At 5:25 pm
    
    Two both of you people as i said that until your comments are not abusive we are not going to delete them .Our is a serious forum for truth seekers its not like hate monger agniveer….you are welcome to put your views…..on the rebuttal of this article this point
    Response :Moon Light in The Noble Qur’an
    http://www.islamhinduism.com/responses/answering-agniveer/77-moon-light-in-noble-quran
    Full response is in d way…..
  - KalBhairav April 4, 2011 At 5:29 pm
    
    Full response is in d way…..
    Cant wait for it. Once I read that I am sure I will be convinced that 2+2 is indeed 4. Until then, I will be thinking 2+2 = 5.
  - Vajra April 4, 2011 At 5:42 pm
    
    Ahmad
    Yours is the religion which does not allow non Muslims even practice and preach their religion openly in Islamic countries and now its you who is lecturing on freedom of expression 🙂 Why do you and other prophet Zakir’s followers prove yourself hypocrites every time?
- Vajra April 4, 2011 At 5:28 pm
  
  Namaste Ahmad
  Unfortunately the Islamic scientist who wrote this article on moon light is not aware of the simple phenomenon of reflection 🙁
  For the reflection to happen-
  1. something (called reflector) other than the source is required
  2. In the lamp, its not REFLECTED light but TRANSMITTED light which illuminates the surroundings 🙂
  And on Allah to be spiritual reflected light, the question of Brother Indian Agnostic still stands, whose spiritual light, Allah is reflecting ? 🙂 Or who is the source of this spiritual light of which Allah is reflection? Just saying, his own, contradicts with the terminology of reflection as per science.
  Just remember, the source is called emitter, not reflector 😉
  
  - AHMAD April 4, 2011 At 5:39 pm
    
    @ vajra
    Read the article thoroughly your all childish question has been answrd aptly.
  - Vajra April 4, 2011 At 5:46 pm
    
    Ahmad
    Just paste here the relevant portion of the answer as I couldn’t find it anywhere 🙁
    And can you defend what is written in the article or you are just another ummi messenger of Mushafiq Sultan like Brother Faizan? 🙂
  - AHMAD April 4, 2011 At 5:49 pm
    
    I f you have subtle point and you think that you stand on truth side you can come there and comment.
    Now upto you..
    tHNX
  - Vajra April 4, 2011 At 6:03 pm
    
    Ahmad
    I dont consider the people willing to kill, convert, force others worth debating. Those asking for death punishment for apostates and implementation of Shariyat are not to be dealt with dialogues as their intellect fails to grasp logic and reasoning.
    But on this forum when people like you start giving the shit of 7th century Arabia, it becomes necessary to reply to make your Arabic fathers aware that their time is over now. The crap they want to sell has no customer in civilized societies anymore. So enjoy it yourself.
    And may I also give you a suggestion! Instead of remaining slaves of Arabs, come back to your ancestral home, Vedic Dharm.
    Thanks
  - Tree Squirrel April 4, 2011 At 6:36 pm
    
    Vajra
    It seems you are out of your senses. Your comment reflects the pathetic state of your mind. You might be an ancestor worshipper but we are not. you ancestors were deluded and it is logical to bury their 20th century BC crap in the dustbin of history. Islam liberated us from Hindus like who were the worst creatures under the sky. We are proud of our forefathers who abandoned the curse of Hinduism. We are God’s servants and that man from Arabia is our guide and we feel no shame in accepting him. You Hindus are narrow minded land and ancestor worshippers. You will not understand the universality of religion because your cult never went out of India and it will die its death here very soon.
  - KalBhairav April 4, 2011 At 7:05 pm
    
    @Tree Squirrel:
    Another unabashed terrorist on agniveer. Great! You ran away from the other thread. Never mind. My expectations of Muslims like you keeps decreasing with every passing comment like yours above. Keep it up.
  - AHMAD April 4, 2011 At 7:23 pm
    
    @Kalbhairav
    T errorist …???????
    Its just tell your mentality and hatredness…..you people call yourself the taker of truth and compassion with all….its shows and expose actually what agniveer and his group stand for…i am nt et all surprised by your words because here all of you split this venom and on the other side you people claim that you want truth to prevail
  - KalBhairav April 4, 2011 At 7:34 pm
    
    Hey smart aleck:
    While we are on the subject of terrorism, answer based on your so-called knowledge of comparative religion:
    What is the punishment for apostasy in Hinduism?
    What is the punishment for apostasy in Islam?
  - Vajra April 4, 2011 At 7:39 pm
    
    Ahmad
    What will you call a person who threatens you of wiping your religion out? Do you know what terrorist means?
    BTW Zakir Naik is another terrorist in this list as he openly supports killing of apostates and ban on non Muslim preachings in Islamic states.
    And if you support him, you are also in this list. whats wrong in it?
  - hardcorehindu April 13, 2011 At 3:04 pm
    
    @ Ahmad
    Oh yeah mate, u r all so peace loving, truth seeking, open minded people that everyone here seems to misinterpret you.
    I am hallucinating here for sure.
  - Vajra April 4, 2011 At 7:33 pm
    
    Namaste Tree Squirrel
    ————-Islam liberated us from Hindus like who were the worst creatures under the sky.—————
    You had to pay the price for this liberation in the form of your mothers and sisters who were dragged away as ghanimat ka maal (war booty) to satisfy the lust of Allah’s best creatures Ghazis like Qasim, Ghauri, Mahmood, Tuglak, Khilji, Taimur, Babur, Humayun, Akbar, Aurangzeb, and their Muslim warriors.
    And this liberation is something where
    1. an Arab can marry your sister but you cant marry any Arab woman because you are NON ARAB.
    2. Any NON ARAB cant become Caliph of Muslim Ummah because it is reserved for the Quraish clan (Muhammad’s forefathers’ Arabic clan) only. The poor non Arabs can only be the loyal servant/slaves of Arabs who cant rule.
    Still want to know what is ancestor worship and who does it?
    ———–We are proud of our forefathers who abandoned the curse of Hinduism. ————
    Instead of your forefathers, feel more proud of those ghazis who raped and killed your mothers, sisters and other ancestors to make them Muslim.
    ———-your cult never went out of India .———-
    I would prefer to follow a cult which is peacefully dying without creating troubles to others, but not something which goes out everywhere holding the sword and converts people into it.
    ———–and it will die its death here very soon————-
    The “rapists of your ancestors” cum “your Arab masters” have been trying this for more than 1400 years. We still exist because our ancestors were those who showed the rapist Ghazis the path of Jannat ul Firdaus in the battle fields. But unfortunately, many of them could not stand against the Jihad of Ghazi invaders and the very descendants of those unfortunate ancestors are today’s Indian, Pakistani, Bangladeshi, and Afganistani Muslims.
    So friend Tree squirrel, try to explore other trees around because the one you live on is a cactus without fruits and leaves. It can only make you bleed at best.
    Best Regards
  - roger April 4, 2011 At 8:18 pm
    
    @bro vajra
    hah, he’s already bleeding
  - sanatanaakki April 4, 2011 At 8:38 pm
    
    @ Vajra..
    Very impressive indeed……loved ur explanation…
  - KalBhairav April 4, 2011 At 9:27 pm
    
    @Vajra:
    So friend Tree squirrel, try to explore other trees around because the one you live on is a cactus without fruits and leaves. It can only make you bleed at best.
    Great line!
    Unfortunately, the Abrahamic my-way-or-the-highway-to-hell-type intellectual/actual terrorists are completely clueless. They come here, one by one they get denuded, then they run like a squirrel into the hole they have dug for themselves in the ground.
    Why is it so difficult for Muslims to simply come out and say, hey Kufrs, you know what? Our interpretation of the Quran/Hadiths has been wrong for 1400 years. No way can death be the punishment for apostasy and eternal hellfire be the solution for you Kufrs.
    Instead they come here, accuse us of spouting venom (all the while adamantly refusing to acknowledging the hate-speech in the Quran itself and the bloodshed of their heritage) and then get their asses handed out to them in 4-5 comment sequences. How do they have the intellectual courage to come on back here or face someone in the real world proudly and confidently with their head held high when their stance has been completely and thoroughly demolished? 🙁
    I will never know.
  - Vajra April 4, 2011 At 11:49 pm
    
    Namaste Brothers KalBhairav, roger and sanatanakki
    ————Why is it so difficult for Muslims to simply come out and say, hey Kufrs, you know what? Our interpretation of the Quran/Hadiths has been wrong for 1400 years. No way can death be the punishment for apostasy and eternal hellfire be the solution for you Kufrs.———–
    Would like to share my views on this. I really dont know what exactly the reason is but as far as I could understand, there is a fundamental difference b/w Dharmic and Abrahmic religions. Dharmic ones establish the relationship of father/mother and son b/w God and its creatures. [Twam hi nah pitaa vaso twam maataa shatakrato babhuvitah- Atharvaved]. This way we are encouraged to love God and its creatures as we love our parents and siblings. This love driven faith never tries to interfere in other’s love driven faith because love is not something which can be imposed but it is induced. Even if one does not want to believe God at all, it remains his personal matter as Dharmic doctrines provide one space and time for inducing the love towards divine without bringing in any degree of fear whatsoever. The whole Law of Karma and reincarnation are only for providing space and time for the same.
    But on the other hand, Abrahamic religions in general and Islam in particular establish the relationship of master and slave b/w God and its creatures. Allah of Quran failed to understand that slave can never love its master but can only fear him. 🙁 Thus in Abrahamic religions, fear remains the driving force behind any belief in divine. Fear, being two way process (if one fears, he will frighten others too), becomes the integral part of one’s behavior in such a manner that he will either fear (if faces strong) or frighten (if faces weak). This way the slaves of Allah, who are known to fear Allah, frighten others as they think to have license for the same. A rough analogy is the ragging in the colleges! A fresher is ragged by seniors and when he meets his juniors next year, he rags them thinking that he was also ragged and thus he has moral right to do same with his juniors. And this process goes on and on..
    This slavery is so dangerous that one becomes ready to marry his 6 year old daughter to a pedophile of 54 and a son offers her wife to his father to satisfy his lust 🙁 So the slavery robs one’s intellectual capabilities first and then makes him act like a puppet of his master without thinking right or wrong. Muslims (and especially Indian Muslims) have suffered the most of this slavery as they are not direct slaves of Allah. They are slaves of slaves (Arab Muslims/Caliph) of slave (Muhammad) of Allah 🙁 So the fanaticism in Indian Muslims is the most in the world as it is cubic function of slavery.
    But i think ancestral roots are more powerful than the foreign slavery. I never loose hope because of this
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_HNNgKiGyWE
  - Rushmore April 4, 2011 At 10:48 pm
    
    Vajra, bigots are like the pupils of the eyes. The more light you pour, the more they contract. The forefathers of Mushafiqs and Treesquirrels must be turning in their graves, right now…
  - Vajra April 4, 2011 At 11:56 pm
    
    Agreed Brother Rushmore
amer April 9, 2011 At 10:55 pm

agniveer you are scholar of vedas and quran

Aziz April 11, 2011 At 6:59 am

well dude you look like an intelligent person i have read some of your articles I cannot answer them as i don’t have much knowledge about them but some of your concepts about Islam are very wrong you should come out with your questions and conepts about Islam and argue with some great scholars of Islam anyof your choice i wouldnt say Zakir naik because then you will call me a follower of him as i m not his follower but of my Prophet and Allah .. you should debate with them face to face and we shall see what happens 🙂 just a suggestion no hard feelings
I expect a reply from you on my email

- KalBhairav April 11, 2011 At 11:19 am
  
  @Aziz:
  Welcome to Agniveer. We get a variety of Muslims commenting here inviting us to understand the true message of Islam. Unfortunately when we probe them a little bit on Islamic theology and its applicability to modern life, they fail miserably under the weight of scrutiny. What is the point of understanding the true message of a theology when one of its features is pure hatred for the non-believer? A recent example would be the user by name AHMAD. Please follow the sequence of posts beginning here to judge for yourself.
  Best wishes.
  
- Vajra April 11, 2011 At 12:27 pm
  
  Namaste Aziz
  Please see
  http://agniveer.com/1046/debate-islam/
  http://agniveer.com/789/zakir-scared/
  
  - Vajra April 11, 2011 At 12:28 pm
    
    @Aziz
    This also http://agniveer.com/series/zakir-exposed/
xxxmuslim April 11, 2011 At 10:46 am

I left islam,thanks to ali sinha,agniveer,indian agnostic 🙂

- KalBhairav April 11, 2011 At 11:10 am
  
  @xxxmuslim:
  You are a liar. You are just a Hindu posting under a Muslim name. If you were a true Muslim then you need not look out of the Quran for any of your needs – be it your needs to know about physics, chemistry, biology or economics. Dont you know that Quran has truth for all of mankind for all time to come? If you are a Hindu posting under a Muslim name or indeed an apostate of Islam, may Allah curse you with eternal hellfire in the afterlife. Allaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahu Akbbbbbbbbbaaaaaaaaaaarrrrrr
  Just kidding 😉 Enjoy your new-found freedom.
  
  - xxxmuslim April 11, 2011 At 8:08 pm
    
    lol I had enough..I have brains to analyze the truth and false,by watching video of lier zakir naik,omg I though quran is full of scientific facts,QURAN has no science in it….good bye to evil allah 😛 and oooh yeh ballssssss to moham MAD..sorry MOHAM MAD,u cant fool me
Aziz April 12, 2011 At 8:10 am

but still there’s a difference between a normal person and a person who has great knoledge of religions.. you should argue with people who are scholars of Islam I m not inviting you to accept Islam just to say that some of your thinkings about Islam are wrong .. anyways ciao

- Vajra April 12, 2011 At 10:48 am
  
  Namaste Aziz
  Please refer the links I shared previously.
  
- hardcorehindu April 13, 2011 At 12:24 pm
  
  @ Aziz
  Namaskar
  I dont think theres anything wrong with any religion. However i think there is something grossly wrong with some sect of the preachers of every religion. Its sad that the % of this is very high in Islam. Is something wrong with what is being taught in your religion by the so called islamic scholars? pls start with Mr. Zakir Naik. i havent seen a bigger shameless religious preacher. I heard one of his lectures where he justified beating women….
  
  - Jay August 21, 2012 At 3:16 am
    
    Read “The Truth About Mohammed” and learn what kind of man he really was and the religion he started. http://www.thecrescentorthecross.com/Robert%20Spencer%20-%20The%20Truth%20About%20Muhammad.pdf
- Jay August 21, 2012 At 3:15 am
  
  Aziz go to ex-Muslim Ali Sina’s site http://www.faithfreedom.org and take up his challenge.
  
xxxmuslim April 12, 2011 At 11:06 am

scholars of islam are the biggest liers…just like moham Mad 😛

hardcorehindu April 13, 2011 At 12:21 pm

Agniveerji – The work done by your team is commendable. I would like to read an article from you comparing India and all Islamic nations in all aspects. There are some real basic reasons why Islamic nations arent progressive. They are blessed with oil and guns.

- Vajra April 13, 2011 At 10:16 pm
  
  Namaste hardcorehindu
  By the time Agniveer does that, here is some interesting views of a Pakistani scholar Hassan Nisar on Islamic history and heroes
  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ZoYC9YPkSw
  
hardcorehindu April 14, 2011 At 12:46 pm

@ Agniveer
Every religion after a certain time evolves. For example there were many concepts in Hinduism (example Sati) which have been abolished after there were reformers and scholars who had the capacity to think. Hinduism being a tolerant relgion accepted these changes with good spirit.
On the other hand most of the other extreme religions have failed to have such reformers and scholars and since the religion is non-tolerant such reformers (if at all there were any) have faced dire consequences.
When there r 2 religions with one being tolerant and other intolerant, it is quite possible that the intolerant religion will try to dominate. We as Hindus are 2 tolerant. We should stop being so and become Orthodox too. But there is a risk in that approach. We may stop thinking.
So the question is: How do we hit the right balance?

- 108Eternal May 15, 2011 At 3:58 am
  
  Namaste brother.
  Just wanted to clarify something in your post. Sati was, is and never will be a part of Sanatana Dharma. There is not a single verse in Vedas which speaks of Sati.
  It has always been a social practice. It’s cause is not Sanatana Dharma, but the ignorance of some people.
  
108Eternal May 15, 2011 At 3:58 am

Namaste.
This is not relevant to the article by the way.
I’d like to know why Agniveer is not analysing christianity? The inhumane conversion practices of christian missionaries is a severe threat not only in Bharat but the world over. Behind the mask of christian missionaries are people who would do anything and everything it takes to convert someone including forcing people to convert (by exploiting the poor, uneducated,.etc). For example:
http://ibnlive.in.com/generalnewsfeed/news/six-held-for-forceful-religious-conversion/658055.html
http://www.haindavakeralam.com/HKPage.aspx?PageID=13714&SKIN=B
I truly appreciate everything Agniveer is doing and for bringing myself along with countless others to the True Path of Vedic Dharma, but it would be great if you guys can put up some articles analysing christianity as well, to show people just how illogical and inhumane it is.
Thanks. 🙂

- helping May 15, 2011 At 10:35 am
  
  hii !! friend go to
  satyagni . com
  here christanity is also being analysed , this is agniveer website only . since now agniveer divided in two..
  this is one topic
  http://satyagni.com/2099/why-i-left-christianity/
  
  - 108Eternal May 15, 2011 At 4:16 pm
    
    Namaste brother.
    Thanks a lot. I’ll check it out. 🙂
    Btw, I think that the Satyagni site isn’t receiving as much exposure as the Agniveer site, and since it’s the Satyagni site that analyses christianity, many people may not get to learn about the truth about christianity.
    Maybe promote the site more? Just a suggestion. 🙂
Jack July 20, 2012 At 2:34 pm

Dr. Zakir Naik ( M.B.B.S ) = Bachelor of Madressa , Bachelor of Saitaan

- Fatima August 20, 2012 At 12:39 am
  
  You all hindus r afraid of Dr Zakir because he is abolishing hinduism and is dominating Islam that’s why u ppl can’t do anything and can just accuse him with the help of a blog but all this is useless ………
  
  - Aditya August 20, 2012 At 12:26 pm
    
    See he is spreading wrong message about hinduism.All of his claims on vedas are wrong.Moreover who is he to talk about the vedas.What is his qualification in Sanskrit?Is he a Masters or P.Hd in sanskrit?Moreover not all can explain the meaning of vedas.There are 2 kinds of sanskrit.Vedic sanskrit and Classical Sanskrit(mastered and pioneered by panini).There is a huge difference in this.Moreover no college or University will teach Vedic sanskrit,they only teach Classical.Does this mean Zakir studied in a veda patashala?Only people who study in Veda Patashala can interpret the meaning of vedas.This is a conclusive evidence that he is spreading rumors .Moreover you can exactly mention when mohammed was born and quran was written.Well can you do it in vedas? This proves that quran is man made and it is fake.Well according to you Allah sent 1,24,000 messengers.And he sends a new revelation when the old one is corroupted.Well it proves the incompetency of your god to protect one message.Read this
    This shows we have advanced methods of preservation.
    WAS QURAN FIRST TO GIVE ANY OF THE FOLLOWING
    1)ZERO
    2)DECIMALS
    3)GEOMETRY
    4)Pi
    5)calculus
    6)medicines
    7)Surgery
    8)metallurgy
    9)astronomy
    10)quantum physics
    11)theory of relativity
    12)phonetics
    13)astrology
    14)navigation
    15)yoga and meditation
    16)Physics
    17)Chemistry
    18)advanced study of plants and animals
    19)binary system
    20)SANSKRIT(mother of many european and asian languages)
    and more………i mean a lot
    Well the above are necessary for the advancement of humans.All the scientific and Technological changes can take place only if the above things were there.AND MIND YOU ALL THESE WERE GIVEN TO THE WORLD BY VEDAS.ALL THESE TRAVELED THROUGHOUT THE WORLD.IF YOU ARE TYPING ON A KEYBOARD,IT IS BECAUSE OF VEDAS(BINARY SYSTEM).IF YOU ARE SAFELY TRAVELING ON A FLIGHT, IT IS DUE THE FOUNDATION IN NAVIGATION BY THE VEDAS.IF YOU ARE USING METALS NOW IT IS BECAUSE OF THE VEDAS.IF YOU ARE LIVING INSIDE A BUILDING,IT IS BECAUSE OF GEOMETRY AND PI CONTRIBUTED BY VEDAS.
    IF MANY DISEASES ARE CURABLE NOW,IT IS BECAUSE OF YOGA.IF PEOPLE ARE GETTING PEACE OF MIND,IT IS BECAUSE OF MEDITATION.
    BUT IN WHAT WAY DID QURAN RADICALLY CHANGE THE WAY A MAN LIVED?YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT GUIDANCE,DHARMIC WAY OF LIVING IS THE GREATEST GUIDANCE.FOLLOWING ARE THE QUOTES OF FAMOUS PEOPLE.
    Will Durant, American historian: “India was the motherland of our race, and Sanskrit the mother of Europe’s languages: she was the mother of our philosophy; mother, through the Arabs, of much of our mathematics; mother, through the Buddha, of the ideals embodied in Christianity; mother, through the village community, of self-government and democracy. Mother India is in many ways the mother of us all”
    VERY IMPORTANT—->
    Albert Einstein, American scientist: “We owe a lot to the Indians, who taught us how to count, without which no worthwhile scientific discovery could have been made.”
    Max Mueller, German scholar: If I were asked under what sky the human mind has most fully developed some of its choicest gifts, has most deeply pondered on the greatest problems of life, and has found solutions, I should point to India.
    Romain Rolland, French scholar : “If there is one place on the face of earth where all the dreams of living men have found a home from the very earliest days when man began the dream of existence, it is India.”
    Henry David Thoreau, American Thinker & Author: Whenever I have read any part of the Vedas, I have felt that some unearthly and unknown light illuminated me. In the great teaching of the Vedas, there is no touch of sectarianism. It is of all ages, climbs, and nationalities and is the royal road for the attainment of the Great Knowledge. When I read it, I feel that I am under the spangled heavens of a summer night.
    R.W. Emerson, American Author: In the great books of India, an empire spoke to us, nothing small or unworthy, but large, serene, consistent, the voice of an old intelligence, which in another age and climate had pondered and thus disposed of the questions that exercise us.
    VERY IMPORTANT—–>
    Hu Shih, former Ambassador of China to USA: “India conquered and dominated China culturally for 20 centuries without ever having to send a single soldier across her border.
    Will Durant, American Historian: “India will teach us the tolerance and gentleness of mature mind, understanding spirit and a unifying, pacifying love for all human beings.”
    VERY IMPORTANT——->
    William James, American Author: “From the Vedas we learn a practical art of surgery, medicine, music, house building under which mechanized art is included. They are encyclopedia of every aspect of life, culture, religion, science, ethics, law, cosmology and meteorology.”
    Max Muller, German Scholar: “There is no book in the world that is so thrilling, stirring and inspiring as the Upanishads
    VERY IMPORTANT——>
    P. Johnstone: “Gravitation was known to the Hindus (Indians) before the birth of Newton. The system of blood circulation was discovered by them centuries before Harvey was heard of.”
    Emmelin Plunret: “They were very advanced Hindu astronomers in 6000 BC. Vedas contain an account of the dimension of Earth, Sun, Moon, Planets and Galaxies.” (‘Calendars and Constellations’)
    Schopenhauer: “Vedas are the most rewarding and the most elevating book which can be possible in the world.”
    VERY IMPORTANT——–>
    Wheeler Wilcox: “India – The land of Vedas, the remarkable works contain not only religious ideas for a perfect life, but also facts which science has proved true. Electricity, radium, electronics, airship, all were known to the seers who founded the Vedas.”
    W. Heisenberg, German Physicist: “After the conversations about Indian philosophy, some of the ideas of Quantum Physics that had seemed so crazy suddenly made much more sense.”
    Sir W. Hunter, British Surgeon: “The surgery of the ancient Indian physicians was bold and skilful. A special branch of surgery was dedicated to rhinoplasty or operations for improving deformed ears, noses and forming new ones, which European surgeons have now borrowed.”
    Sir John Woodroffe: “An examination of Indian Vedic doctrines shows that it is in tune with the most advanced scientific and philosophical thought of the West.”
    B.G. Rele: “Our present knowledge of the nervous system fits in so accurately with the internal description of the human body given in the Vedas (5000 years ago). Then the question arises whether the Vedas are really religious books or books on anatomy of the nervous system and medicine.” (‘The Vedic Gods’)
    Adolf Seilachar & P.K. Bose, scientists: “One Billion-Year-Old fossil prove life began in India: AFP Washington reports in Science Magazine that German Scientist Adolf Seilachar and Indian Scientist P.K. Bose have unearthed fossil in Churhat a town in Madhya Pradesh, India which is 1.1 billion years old and has rolled back the evolutionary clock by more than 500 million years.”
    Will Durant, American Historian: “It is true that even across the Himalayan barrier India has sent to the west, such gifts as grammar and logic, philosophy and fables, hypnotism and chess, and above all numerals and the decimal system.”
    Colonel James Todd: “Where can we look for sages like those whose systems of philosophy were prototypes of those of Greece: to whose works Plato, Thales and Pythagorus were disciples? Where do I find astronomers whose knowledge of planetary systems yet excites wonder in Europe as well as the architects and sculptors whose works claim our admiration, and the musicians who could make the mind oscillate from joy to sorrow, from tears to smile with the change of modes and varied intonation?
    YOU SEE EVEN IF THE QURAN WAS NOT REVEALED,THE WORLD WOULD HAVE SURVIVED,DEVELOPED AND PROSPERED.THE DHARMIC WAY OF LIVING IS CONSIDERED THE BEST.THIS WOULD HAVE NOT BEEN POSSIBLE IF THERE WERE NO VEDAS.A REVELATION OF GOD SHOULD COMPLETELY CHANGE THE WAY A MAN LIVED.WHAT DID QURAN CONTRIBUTE TO MANKIND WHICH CHANGED THE LIFESTYLE DRASTICALLY??
  - dogra August 20, 2012 At 6:32 pm
    
    Superb Aditya,
    Guess a number of non hinuds think they can yap on about sanatan dharma, but have no idea of the beautiful humanity within Hinduism-real name sanatan dharma
  - Fatima August 21, 2012 At 6:11 pm
    
    if u have read the Quran then their is a lot about astrology and the first ever scientists were Muslims later their books were taken
  - Aditya August 21, 2012 At 6:54 pm
    
    I have read the Quran,bible and Vedas.You just have a few verses but we have have a whole science dealing with it.it is known as jyothisham.Moreover have you heard about susrutha,chraka,aryabhatta….And the list goes.BTW we are the first to introduce 0,decimal,geometry and algebra.Without the above math,your scientists could have done nothing.
    If Quran was a real revelation,what did it contribute to revolutionizing the way man lived? Actually islam is the reason for slow growth in India.If you people were not at all born,for the science we had,we would have sent man beyond the solar system by now.
    moreover there are just 10 muslim noble prize winners but there are 7 hindus.Do you just see the ratio with the population?
    Moreover sanskrit is the best language for programming.If quran was a real revelation,why isn’t arabic the best.
    BTW the majority of scientific,mathematical,philosophical and Spiritual ideas/inventions were given by hindus and Christians.You can count the contribution of islam just by your fingers.
    BTW islam has always been spread through violence and there is no religion which promotes killing infidels(Jihad),speaking lies(Taqqiya) and make women wear Ninja Suits.You people kill animals and call that your religion is peaceful.Your prophet married a 6yr old girl,had sex when she was 9.He had 40 slaves,many wives and Invaded places.He led crusades against holy Christian shrines.NOW THAT’S WHAT YOU CALL A PROPHET? Moreover infidels are sent to hell according to quran.Our God does not discriminate against a hindu or non-hindu.Our god just see the deeds of a soul and not his identity.Your god likes to be praised and followed and his opposer are sent to hell.This sounds like a cinema Villain,praise me and if you stand against me,you are killed.See agniveer and arya samaj are not stupid to just raise claims without any proofs like Zakir.BTW list out the contributions of Islam and I can show it’s roots in Vedas.IT IS A CHALLENGE
  - Jay August 21, 2012 At 10:43 pm
    
    Here is how Islamic “inventions” did not change the world – manly because it was other people who invented it that Muslims them passed off as theirs http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Islamic_Inventions%3F_How_Islamic_Inventors_Did_Not_Change_The_World
  - Jay August 21, 2012 At 10:47 pm
    
    Read the book The Truth About Mohammed link above and this Unmasking Mohammed http://islam-watch.org/SujitDas/Unmasking_Muhammad.pdf
1india August 22, 2012 At 12:14 am

I think Arabs outsmarted long ago by creating such slave zombies that could serve arabs and keep killing people for ages by holding a fake book. Muslim/Islam/Arabs have hardly any contribution to human race, they borrow all kind of science and comfort from westerns and still they keep shouting like they have invented all these. Pakistan blocks sites like youtube, I say why dont you disappear forever from internet, as internet reveals the truth (lies for you). Do stitch to your hollybook filled up with fake science or discover the new if you can.
@ Aditya, i copied everything. Many ThanX!!!

- Jay August 22, 2012 At 4:08 am
  
  Actually Arabs were the first victims of Islam. Read the Truth About Mohamed in the link I posted above. Mohammed was an Arab polytheist by birth. His own people were priests who ran the Kaaba. The Kaaba was already a religious site long before Mohammed created Islam. Mohammed for some reason felt the Jewish faiths of Judaism and Christianity were superior to his own Arab people’s polythestic faiths. He insulted and attacked his own Arab people’s religions. He wanted to be the prophet not of his own Arab people’s religion but of the Jews, that is why he fashioned Islam to come after the Jew Jesus and the Jewish faith of Christianity and fashioned himself to be the last of the prophets of the Jewish faiths with Islam being the last and most correct version of Judaism. Thanks to Mohammed all Arab native religions were destroyed that is why today none exist. All due to Mohammed. He would not allow Arab polytheism to survive and demanded that all Arabs convert. He did allow Jews and Christians as older Jewish faith followers to remain as dhimmis – tolerated by Muslims but treated inferior to Muslims. Arabs following their own native Arab polytheistic religions were the first victims of Mohammed and his Arab pagan version of Judaism, Islam.
  
  - Aditya August 23, 2012 At 10:47 pm
    
    I can see a lot of misinterpretations of vedas by muslims.My point is what is muslim’s qualification in sanskrit?There are two kinds of sanskrit.One is vedic and another is classical(Mastered and pioneered by panini).The vedic sanskrit was among a few only.From the advent of classical sanskrit,it has been the official and common language.the difference between vedic sanskrit and classical sanskrti is like the difference between Victorian english and american english.Moreover universities nowadays only teach classical sanskrit.Vedic sanskrit is taught only in veda patashalas.Does this mean the muslims who comment on vedas have studied in veda patashalas?Moreover no muslim has done even a diploma in Classical sanskrit,then how can they comment on vedas which were written in vedic sanskrit?This is a conclusive proof that people like Zakir are spreading the wrong messages about the vedas.Moreover I find even educated muslims believing this.If you use logic,you would question what is the source of muslim’s knowledge on vedas.
  - Aditya August 23, 2012 At 10:55 pm
    
    I read the link you mentioned.Actually many of the scientific developments can be traced to India.
    Many people from Greece,Egypt,china,Babylon,etc.Came to Taxila,Nalanda and Ujjain for learning.There were nearly 69 departments in Taxila and Nalanda.It was the epicenter of Ancient learning.I request all Agniveers to search “Pride of India” in google books.I even sent the link to agniveerji.All of you please read it for more info on our scientific achievements .
  - Aditya August 23, 2012 At 11:02 pm
    
    Actually I have felt the same.I feel like Max Muller,Mohammed framed his own religion just like that.Though Max Muller’s aryan invasion theory has been proved wrong,we are in the process of proving islam too.I have read the Sharia Law,and it is one of the worst law books on earth,and muslims claim it to solve all social problems(i like their sense of humor).
    Satyameva Jayate
  - Jay August 24, 2012 At 2:43 am
    
    Max Muller did not believe in a race called Aryan. People took his linguistic categorizations and racialized them but he thought “…an ethnologist who speaks of Aryan race, Aryan blood, Aryan eyes and hair, is as great a sinner as a linguist who speaks of a dolichocephalic dictionary or a brachycephalic grammar” http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Max_M%C3%BCller
1india August 22, 2012 At 1:55 pm

@Jay
The books is too long. Not sure but will try to read.
If Muslim can justify 9 wives of prophet, including a 9 year old girl & marrying his own daughter in law, they can claim anything. It feels like living in 21st century and reading funny discoveries of stone age people who even dont know how lightning takes place.
Now Nasa has landed robots on Mars. And if they find something, a new zakir naik will come up with stories that it is already written in holly book 1400 years ago.
Better invest some time in reading Ved.

- 1india August 22, 2012 At 1:59 pm
  
  The starting with Narcissus in the book really made me laugh though.
  
- Jay August 23, 2012 At 10:39 pm
  
  The information is there for everyone. Read a little or read the whole thing. Take it at your own pace.
  
jai shankar August 23, 2012 At 10:26 pm

ISLAM KI SACCHAI 10 – pahli to baat ye hai ki islam ya Christian ye dharm nahi hai.sabse badi bhul logonki yahi ho gayi.galti se logone in dono ko dharm samaj liya hai.ye dharm nahi apitu religion hai,jiska thik-thik arth panth,sanpraday ya kisi vyakti vishesh dwara chalaya gaya ”aadesh” ”hukumnama” kah sakte hai jisme manviya vichar ki swatantrata ko puri tarah se vinasta kiya gaya ho.dharm ka yatharth rup religion nahi hai.dharm ka arth hi itna vishal aur jivan se juda hai ki hindu ke sabse pahale purusharth dharm hai.buddha aur jain ye bhi dhamma hai. in ki bhi dharna hindu se alag nahi hai.philosophy bhale hi alag ho par jivan ko dekhne ka drustikon me koi fark nahi.yam niyam teen dharm me ek saman hi hai.ahinsa ko in donone jyada mulya ka mana hai.par buddha ki ahinsa aur mahaveer ki ahinsa aur nagnta nirdosh hai,unke sadhna ke gahare anubhav se aaya amrut hai.par unke anuyayi ki ahinsa thopi hui aur nagnta nirdosh nahi hai, bina anubhav se aayi ek opcharikta ban gayi hai.ye dosh agar dur huye to ye dharm kahe ja sakte hai.par islam me to kuch bhi nahi hai,keval ek aadesh hukum manana,aur uske aage jhukna yahi dharm hai.jisne bhi is ko nahi mana use jabardasti se manvaya gaya.aurangjeb ne shivaji ke bete sanbhaji ko mar dala,guru tegbahadur ko mar dala.ye sabut hai ki islam kya hai.islam dharm nahi hai.

Truth Seeker August 24, 2012 At 10:47 am

@anti-agnii
I could not understand why do Muslim hate with Arya Samaj too much even than Ali Sina.

- Truth Seeker August 24, 2012 At 12:38 pm
  
  @anti-agnii
  I have read Satyarth Parkash in which Swami Dayanand criticize Hindu for their superstitions and downfall. Dayanand criticize the people having faith in God-incarnation to give massage or sending postmen/messengers etc. with a massage. Swami Dayanand was against bowing before stones and associating human name with God. He criticism the Hindu and Muslims for bowing before stones to please God.
  
Jay August 24, 2012 At 11:12 pm

Truth Seeker already provided you the Agniveer article dealing with your question. Please stop posting the same question onto different threads and pick one. Here is the thread with Truth Seeker’s reply to you with Agniveer’s link http://agniveer.com/scientific-errors-in-hinduism/

Miracles of Islam March 3, 2019 At 5:47 pm

[…] which science has come to know recently! So this is considered another miracle by Zakir Naik that Quran contains science! We agree completely on this with him! Because if we go by the definition of miracle, it is […]