Some big myths on Vedas and how they are most dangerous to our culture:
Myth 1: Vedas are not revealed. They are written by Rishis
Fact: Vedas were provided at inception of civilization by Paramatma and not created by an human.
Brief Analysis:
a. All ancient aarsh texts and even new Purans consider Vedas as revealed knowledge. Even Vedas claim so. Further there is no evidence whatsoever to make a claim that Vedas are written by Rishis.
b. Rishis are those people who through their deep meditation found meanings of these verses. The suktas on which a particular Rishi meditated is referred with that Rishi’s name. So Rishi are Mantra-Drashta and not Mantra-Rachayita (They are seers and not creators of Mantras)
c. Many mantras in Vedas have more than one rishis. Some have even thousand rishis. How can thousand rishis together make one verse?
d. The same Mantra in Vedas occurring at different sections have different Rishis. How can that be possible if Rishis were creators of mantras?
e. The logic of those refuting revealed status of Vedas fall in two broad categories
Logic 1: They cannot be revealed because there is no Paramatma, and as per theory of evolution and discoveries of archaeology, man could not be so advanced millions years ago. Further this is against modern science.
Refutation:
- There is no way modern or any science can prove that Paramatma does not exist. So-called scientists have no answer to fundamental questions of universe – who ensures that laws of universe work? what started this process of creation and degeneration? what ensures that we feel pain and sorrow and pleasures. And who is “we”?
Athiests have no answers to these. As a man with advanced studies of modern science by grace of my education, I could find no answers except vague statements to these answers.
- Theory of evolution is a largely rejected theory today because recent discoveries of science and genes do not provide any conclusive evidence towards it. There is no proven theory (and mere conjectures) to answer how humans got created from dust? Why we see snippets of advancements of science and technology in ancient ages if those were indeed primitive times (like iron pillar of delhi, pyramids of egypt, speed of light in Sayana Bhashya, description of aeroplane making in Vimana Shstra etc etc)
- Archeology is a big hoax. What these archeologists do is create entire structure of humanoid in diagrams merely from a biig tooth like stone they discover in one place. There are several excellent resources on net available which discuss these hoaxes in detail.
Basically, the modus operandi of archaeologists suffer from very serious flaws: they have scratched not even .1% of entire earth surface and yet make tall claims, they forget that decay of organic/inorganic things they expect to discover can be much more severe than what their simple maths calculations predict. their dating methods are at best grossly inaccurate, their conjecture that any object could be tooth or bone is highly based on imaginations alone.
Please read http://www.pathlights.com/ce_encyclopedia/sci-ev/sci_vs_ev_TOC.htm for a good detailed review among many available from scholars.
Thus ceteras paribus, there is no evidence whatsoever to prove that Vedas were not revealed and plethora to prove that they are revealed.
This fact of revelation of Vedas is the core foundation of our culture. The moment you try to shake it, you would foolishly put yourself in same category as Islam or Christianity. Any difference with them then becomes only a temporary political issue and not one based on sound logic and reason. The whole of so-called Hindutva and culture movement then falls flat. Because if none is ultimate truth, how you justify that some other psycho, rapist, murderer, jehadi etc is wrong and you are right. Afterall in that case, everyone is equally worng and equally right.
Logic 2: Islam is a brutal religion. Islam is based on belief that Quran is revealed text. Hence anyone who believes on any revealed text is brutal. Since we are not brutal, we cannot beleive that any text (vedas or anything else) can be revealed.
Refutation:
This is the logic Sri Elst has provided. Perhaps this is the irony of those who may have mugged up lot of facts but did not do a thorough practical course in science and logical analysis. That is why perhaps, our ancient education system had so mush of strong emphasis on maths and science. Even Dayanand emphasised the same for same reason – Rote mugging and worshipping stones will make your intellect stone! (This is as per Vidur Niti, if I am correct)
By this logic, whatever Islam believes in, we cannot believe in same! They believe that humans have two legs. So we cannot have two legs! They believe that one should not consume alcohol, so we should start becoming drunkards. They believe Christians will go to hell. Hence we should believe Christians should go to heaven!!
The difference in Quran and Vedas are manifold:
a. Quran was revealed (if at all!) few hundred years ago. Even foreign so-called scholars believe Vedas to be first texts of mankind. A revealed text must be revealed at beginning of creation and not in between.
b. Quran is written in Arabic, a language specfic to a geography. Vedas are in vedic Sanskrit which is mother of all languages of world today
c. Quran contains location specfic descriptions and customs. Vedas contain no geography or history
d. Quran beleives itself to be final edition of God’s message. Now first, God’s message, by definition, has to be flawless and not subject to modifications. And if indeed modifications are necessary in God’s message, then there can be no FINAL edition. The process should then continue.
Vedas on other hand are one and same – they cannot be altered, contain fundamental truths. Their applicability may change depending in times. But the core rules are always applicable.
e. A revealed text should contain source of all possible knowledge. Only Vedas pass this litmus test.
f. Vedas can not be altered at all. Many editions of Quran exist
g. Quran was started by Prophet Muhammad – his personal life exemplifies his character!
etc etc.
So to assume that Vedas are not revealed because Quran is not revealed is only a defect of logic-less mind and prejudice.
Myth 2: Vedas contain Polytheism
Fact: Vedas contain worship of one and only one Paramatma
Brief Analysis:
Logics given by believers of this myth are as follows:
Logic 1: Vedas contain names of many Gods and Goddesses
Refutation:
a. Paramatma is omnipotent and limited human mind cannot comprehend all attributes of Paramatma at same time. So vedas contain prayers to same one Paramatma. Different mantras however focus on different attributes of Paramatma and hence use different adjectives for Paramatma.
b. Even Vedas claim that there is only one Ishwar and not more than that.
Logic 2: Vedic suktas have names of Devatas associated with them. These are the various Gods and Goddesses.
Refutation:
The name of Devata associated with Vedic mantras refer to the subject of that particular sukta. That has nothing to do with various Gods and Goddesses in conventional sense. There are 33 devatas referred in Vedic texts, but this is also clearly elucidated that these refer to inanimate objects and not worth being worshipped. Vedas clearly proclaim that Paramatma is One and He alone is to be worshipped.
The whole confusion comes because ignorants assume Devata to be synonym of Paramatma. Devata means something or someone that gives, enlighten or illuminates. So in many contexts, Paramatma is also Devata. But so is soul/ Atman and all other animate and inanimate objects which satisfies this meaning of Devata. Thus parents, teacher, scholars, spouse are also devatas. Devatas deserve respect because they give us selfless benefits.
But Devata is not the goal of Worship, only Paramatma is, and Vedas are extremely clear on this.
Myth 3: Vedas can be interpreted by western scholars better because they are more scientific:
Fact: To be eligible to interpret Vedas, one has to qualify certain minimum basic requirements
Brief Analysis:
Vedas are for every human being. But to be able to decipher meanings of vedic mantras in scholarly manner, several requirements are must:
a. Understanding of roots of vedic words, grammar and usages
b. A scientific and rational temper of mind
c. And most importantly, being a yogi.
Just as you do not get admitted to IIT or IIM without passing the entrance test, one cannot be eligible to comment on Vedas unless he or she is a yogi.
In other words, one cannot be taken seriously on vedic matters if he or she is say a drunkard, meat-eater, prone to anger, egoist, frustrated, hedonist, etc etc. Simply put he or she has to be a yogi to be a rishi (one who can understand the true meaning of vedas).
Thus Vedas is not a text which every Tom, Dick or Harry can start commenting upon merely by studying some basic conventional sanskrit grammar and reading few sanskrit books. The mantras of vedas are to be unlocked through process of deep meditation and contemplation. More one progresses on yogic path, more clearly is he or she able to understand Vedas. But for a non-yogi with stone mind, only stones can be obtained from Vedas.
Most western scholars, based upon their PhDs from universities based on and equipped for non-vedic studies start assuming that they have a preferential superiority over analysing Vedas. They simply ignore the eligibility conditions for entering into vedic arena.
This is not a blanket statement against all foreigners, but simply on basis of works of most prominent western indologists. This is also not to say that these problems are not infecting those native of India. In fact the problem is much more severe because of their inferiority complex coupled with prejudiced mindsets – likes of Romila Thapar, DN Jha etc are ready examples.
Thus all those who claim to have superior claim on Vedas because of their so-called scientific studies need to be analysed more in detail. People who turn out to be non-yogis (as per Paatanjal Yoga Sutra) have to rejected outrightly.
I shall elucidate on more myths and in more details in future. I wrote this small piece to provide a sense of direction in this matter.
Om
Do not miss these:
About Agniveer
Pradeep,
You can read translation of Vedas and other Hindu scriptures at http://www.sacred-texts.com/hin/index.htm. If you are new, start with Upanishads, Bhagabad Gita before going to Vedas. Vedas are vast and not meant for the impatient. Upanishads and Bhagavad Gita are essence of Vedas but they do not replace Vedas. Vedic path is that self inquiry, self realization where in the follower has to make his own journey with the help of a guru. Good Luck.
It is better to remain ignorant of Vedas than to gain knowledge about Vedas from Ralph Griffith's translations. I prefer translations by Arya Samaj(Maharaishi Dayanand) and All World Gayatri Pariwar(Pandit Shriram Sharma Acharya).
I completely agree. The translations of western indologists are basically trash. Unfortunately many Hindu sites also simply put Griffith's translations online. I believe that an English translation that appeals to common man should be developed. They can be evolved from existing Hindi and Sanskrit translations. Dhanyavad
"Unfortunately many Hindu sites also simply put Griffith's translations online."
Correct. Classic case is this site: http://www.vedrahasya.net
Yesterday, I dropped a mail to this site to remove those idologists translations.
Rig Veda says "Krunvanto Vishwam Aryam". ( 9.63.5). I did a simple exercise. I checked translation of this by Griffith and Wilson:
"Performing every noble work, active, augmenting Indra's strength,
Driving away the godless ones." (Griffith's translation)
http://www.sacred-texts.com/hin/rigveda/rv09063.h…
"Augmenting Indra,urging the waters,making all our acts prsperous,destroying witholders of oblatins" (Wilson)
Now the phrase is not even typical Vedic Sanskrit. It is a very simple phrase to translate.But to Griffith the words "Krunvanto" and "Vishwam" do not exist. To Wilson, all three words do not exist in the verse. The cardinal mimansa rule of interpreation is "Yatha Vachanam Tatha vachanikam" (Read it as it is without adding anything or subtracting anything).Messrs.Wilson and Griffith discard this rule. Probably, the motive is to paint the word "Aryan" as racist. Translating the words as "Ennoble the whole world" would mean they cannot attribute racist connotations to the word.
Agniveerji, I suggest u take a dozen cases like this-simple to translate sentences and show how these indologists have messed up translations to achieve their agenda.
If you read Introduction to Monier Williams Dictionary of Sanskrit-English, he clearly admits that the Boden Chair was established to convert the Indians to Christianity. This Boden Chair of Oxford funded all the research work of Indologists. He also admitted that the purpose of his dictionary was to help missionaries spread Christianity. You can find innumerable evidences in his dictionary that exhibit his unhidden agenda.
I indeed want to take this project as well. Let me just complete a few more projects. If you can provide me a list of controversial verses – where they have provided stupid meanings, that would ease the effort.
Dhanyavad
Of course I will, as and when the same comes to my notice. Thanks
Sir, I hope someday in the future Arya Samaj will decide to make english translations, I know this is a hard and lengthy process, but if this happens, no one including zakir naik can fool people in vedas. Sadly, I have seen many hindus after zakir naik's lecture embrace islam. First, I was thinking they must be fake people whom zakir naik paid, otherwise these fools have no idea how great Vedas are. I just learned Vedic Mathematics and it was great. Nothing is greater than Vedas.
@Bikram Das
Bro…the translations at that website r done by griffith..These r completely fake…
None of the translation is correct…If u read those u will say Vedas r completely doomed..
Actual translations are available at http://www.aryasamajjamnagar.org/rigvedabook.htm
So keep away from the translations by non-Indians …
asalamoalaikum… mr agniveer what a explanation …..
Vedas are for every human being. But to be able to decipher meanings of vedic mantras in scholarly manner, several requirements are must:
a. Understanding of roots of vedic words, grammar and usages
b. A scientific and rational temper of mind
c. And most importantly, being a yogi.
Just as you do not get admitted to IIT or IIM without passing the entrance test, one cannot be eligible to comment on Vedas unless he or she is a yogi.
In other words, one cannot be taken seriously on vedic matters if he or she is say a drunkard, meat-eater, prone to anger, egoist, frustrated, hedonist, etc etc. Simply put he or she has to be a yogi to be a rishi (one who can understand the true meaning of vedas).
Thus Vedas is not a text which every Tom, Dick or Harry can start commenting upon merely by studying some basic conventional sanskrit grammar and reading few sanskrit books. The mantras of vedas are to be unlocked through process of deep meditation and contemplation. More one progresses on yogic path, more clearly is he or she able to understand Vedas. But for a non-yogi with stone mind, only stones can be obtained from Vedas.
bro i want only one thiong that plzzz you too dont comment on vedas since you might not be any meat eater or drunk yard but you r indeed ego centric,,liar and prone to anger..
also it is not at all that only yogi can translate a veda…i wanna know is your vedas wriiten in sme non understandable language or a language out of this world..clearly not ..vedas have many translation ,,or you can say almost all translation clear only few r in parable form…
and how you concluded that meat eaters cannot translate vedas…
when vedas them self testify that you can have meet..
reference..
Vedas are considered as most ancient and most sacred. We find mentioning of non-vegetarian food in Vedas too it is mentioned in Rig-Veda book 10 Hymn 27 verse 2 “Then will I, when I lead my friends to battle against the radiant persons of godless, prepare for thee at home a vigorous bullock, and pour for thee the fifteen fold strong juices”
now plzz try to make me understand some other meaning of this verse…it is clear and umbagious and is in context…
so keep your vedic knowledge with you and you too dont comment if the requirement is to become a yogi…
try to preach the arya dharma to nonmuslim idolaters than criticising muslims….
tell them that there r no gods but one true god[allah,ishwar,paramatma]by whatever butyful name u call….
we practice more than the idolater hindus..
allah haviz…
infact quran is the butyful book containing ambiguous words suitable for each age and contains many phrases and words which only allah and his rasool knows..on which there can be no comment..
many translators have said that the most dificult book to be translated is quran coz every tym we translate we feel that there is smething missing ,,that is allah meant more than we have translated…
the translation available by yusuf ali, pickthall r not wrong but you can say allah meant much deeper than the translation…
see how butyfully allah send his message by the very first verse revealed on beloved prophet in surah alaq..
iqra ! iqra bismi rabbikal lazi khalaq..khalaqal insana min alaq..
that is read . read in the name of thy lord who made..made the human from alaq
alaq means congealed clot of blood[understandable at the tym of prophet muhammad[pbuh and now too]
alaq means [sme thing which sucks the blood or simply suck ]
or alaq means leech lyk or jonk in hindi[modern science has now be able to answer that embroy at its very 1st stage look lyk leech which sucks food from mother body..
thus confirming the verse of quran and its applicability today
that describes the buty of quran and its applicability at every age....
alhumdullilah[praise be to allah]
and wow to you people who even after seeing the clear proofs not percieving it…
may allah guide you to straight path…
allah haviz…
Rashid
Can you enlighten me what is the first verse of Quran?
asalamoalaikum vajra..ya sure bro ……
the first verseof quran ::::::surah fateha .. alhumdulillah e rabbil alameen…
that is..praise be to allah[one true god] the lord of the worlds…
also i didnt exepted that a non yogi can not comment on vedas…plzz read my reply once again.i said if this is the requirement then agniveer also shud keep his comments and description with him..since he is ego centric,,partial..and prone to anger…
allah haviz,..
Namaste Rashid Bhai
What about Bismillah? I found “Bismillah…” as the first verse and you found “alhumdulillah e rabbil alameen”, whats the matter?
I will talk about Alak etc later, first lets sort this matter of first verse of Quran out.
Stating truth is nothing to do with ego or partiality or anger. Refute Agniveer’s claims as they have refuted Allah’s word Quran. And by the way, forget about Agniveer, I can prove Allah not only ego centric, partial and prone to anger but a beggar asking for debt from people, arranging women for prophet, enemy of His own creature, and much more. So better not to comment about Agniveer whether they are Yogi or not.
Namaste..
Rashid Masood
You just accepted that any Non Yogi, meat eater, drinker cant be taken seriously in the matters of translations of Mantras. Now you quote Griffith for the same and prove meat eating in Vedas! Could you see the circular logic of yours?
You wrote-”so keep your vedic knowledge with you and you too dont comment if the requirement is to become a yogi”
How do you know that Agniveer is not Yogi?
You wrote-”try to preach the arya dharma to nonmuslim idolaters than criticising muslims”
Muslims are biggest idolaters of the world because they bow to the biggest idol of the world, Kaba. In addition to that they visit graves and worship the dead. So you see Muslims need in fact more serious treatment than any so called idolaters because problem with Muslims is that they dont even accept that they are idolaters irrespective of the fact that they are. This is not the case with others. They accept that they worship God through idols.
I think Agniveer is fair to both Hindus and Muslims to preach them equally and not favoring anyone unlike Islam, which favors Muslims always and curses non Muslims. So get out of this mindset of “first preach your hindu brothers” because for saints like Agniveer, whole world is their brother and sister and they do not favor only one.
Namaste..
asalamoalaikum vajra..peace be upon you..
you said me abt the circular logic..
i used the logic coz…
agniveer used it…
and u say me how come i know that agniveer is yogi or not..well i ask you the same how can you say that i consume meat.
a muslim can be a good muslim even by not having meat…
now here we come to same rounded logic..
you concluded that i am a meat eater coz i m a muslim..
i concluded that mr agniveer is non yogi since he is self centered and egoist and the description and articles by him on this site clearly describes it..
and no where its written in vedas that meat eater cant understand vedas..
i will soon answer this mr agniveer on the false accusation about dr zakir and his vedic translation..
and regarding idol worship..
which foolish told you that we worship qaaba or sange asbath..or mukaame ibraheem…
well bro it will be clear to you by the neeyat we do while we worship almighty allah..
it is neeyat ki maine namaz waqt [the tym i.e fazir,zohar,asir,maghrib,isha..thast is the tym of namaz from the prescribed 5 times] ..muh mera kaba ki taraf waste allah k..allah o akbar..
i intend to perform prayer ,the tym being [the respective tym ],facing toeards kaaba for the almighty allah[god,parmeshwar or parmatma in ur toungue]…
so its clear that namaaz is only for allah not for kaaba..
kaaba is only our kiblah..that is direction…
it was choosen coz we muslim believe in unity and universal brotherhood…while performing salah[prayer] each namazi whether be king or faqeer stand side to side joining shoulder..showing the equality and no difference in terms of color,caste or smething else…
the khanna qabah was built by prophet abraham and was the first place of worshiping allah..
since abraham[pbuh] built the qabah with very effection and love and took 7 rounds to see the finishing so in his memory god made every haji to encircle around kabah lyk abraham..and made the direction of kabah as qiblah for our prayers..
thats all..
not more than it…
we dont worship it but consider it to be a direction while praying and show our unity and universal brotherhood…
Rashid Bhai Namaste
1. I never said that you consume meat. I said so for western indologists!
2. BTW, its a fact that a Muslim cant be a true Muslim unless he/she sacrifices! Quran says-
“So pray to your Lord, the prayer of the Festival of Immolation (‘īd al-nahr), and sacrifice, your offering.” [108:2]
Brother these lies of Zakir Bhai MBBS to trap vegetarians will be busted here, so try to avoid using Taqiyya on this site!
3. You wrote-”no where its written in vedas that meat eater cant understand vedas”
Well its not written in Quran that an animal cannot write commentary on Quran, does it mean an animal can write commentary on Quran? Thats apart if you really want to know about the reality of meat eating in Vedas, refer http://agniveer.com/68/no-beef-in-vedas/
4. What will happen if I dont face Kaba while praying? What is the necessity of facing Kaba? Can in a mosque, all Muslims poor and rich sitting side by side face any direction other than Kaba? Why not, they will be still united and equal?
5. You said Kaba was the first place of worshipping Allah! So you mean from Adam to Abrahim, all people were unaware of worshipping? What was the need for making place of worship? Why dont you accept that Kaba is house of Allah and you worship it just like idol worshippers worship their idols?
6. What is so special with 7 rounds? Can you refuse to take rounds if it is just in the remembrance of Abraham? When you repeat such a small thing of Abraham which he did to test the finishing, why not repeat other things like gathering stones, labor and many more? Why is it that your Hajj visit is incomplete without taking 7 rounds?
7. Why do you kiss the stone? I know you will come up with another silly answer. I know its difficult for you to accept that kissing and circumambulation etc were the practices of idol worshippers Pagans which Muslims had to adopt.
Visit http://agniveer.com/1685/kaba-or-idol-worship/ to know more about Kaba worship.
I ask you, what is the problem in Vedic belief of worship in which neither associating any person (like Muhammad) in the prayers is needed nor bowing before any stone is needed. Why dont you come back to Dharm of Vedas of your ancestors?
Asalaam alaikum
,
Nice reply brother , iam truely impressed
@rashid masood : the correct translation of the Mantra is found here
on page 55
http://aryasamajjamnagar.org/rugveda_v5/rugveda.htm
All Hindu Scripture’s Conclusion is Qur’an and it is final Scripture. Read well the Vedas and Purana.
Yawn,yawn… How many times can you guys repeat this nonsense from ZN? Please point us to the verse in Veda that concludes that Quran is the so called final scripture.
They dont know that when a book contains contents of previous books, it is called plagiarism!!!
Hello, hindu literatures whatever it may be were written thousands of year before kuran or bible were written . So its a known fact that who has copied whom .
Come under the shade of Vedas and all your doubts will cease. Vedas are the only texts which claim that truth and logic go hand in hand with faith. All others would like you to have faith without scrutiny. Do let me know if you are interested.
No one is interested
Namaster
Its really wonderful what u’ve written.. In fact, I’ve just started reading Rg Ved with the help of my guruji n zen after reading the mantras guruji xplains to us.. Its really wonderful, it makes me feel getting a new direction.. Sir, if you can just write more.. Recently, I read an article about its was about “Why I am not a hindu” on the net itself.. N the person has wrote about The infallibility of the Vedas .. If you can just elaborate on it..
If you give me the link, I can elaborate more. Remember – the only purposeful way of living passes through Vedas. Some may claim that this is a dogmatic statement. However this is farthest from truth. The oldest books on earth, instead, are the most scientific texts available to humanity. The claim for infallibility is not based on any blind prejudice or marketing, as in case of other religious books. Instead its based on intuitive logic – that if God is perfect, his knowledge also is perfect and need not change every now and then. Also, no other book can claim either the accuracy, universalization or comprehensiveness of Vedas. Its a different matter that vested interests and prejudices make them interpret Vedas as per their own thought directions. Keep reading this blog and I promise to bring more relevant matter to fore on this.
western translaters can never ever translate vedas .
Why pepole always believe which is approved by todays modern science only. Science can not answer of all the questions .Todays science stands nowere in front of the kind of science and logics are used in vedas . They are limited to the atomic world only which is based on the atom. Logics behind the vedas can not be understand by todays morden science and they can never proof it.
Any thing which is approved by VEDAS is the ulimate trurh and the correct path to follow ;Because vedas is the supreme science which answers all the questions.
Hiya AgniVeer
Well, all what you’ve written is interesting. I’m an atheist/agnostic but still I respect the Vedas and other texts of Sanatan Dharma simply because they are powerhouses of knowledge. By contrast, the Bible and Quran seem pure fictitious with the claim that the previous texts had got corrupted. O really? Then may be that the all-powerful (?)Allah is useless since he could not protect his own ‘word’ – Bible from corruption by Satan. And further how is he going to protect us humans by this yardstick? That makes Satan more powerful than Allah. All sorts of contradictions.
But here you’ve mentioned that the Vedas and Bhagawad Gita have no contradictions. Sorry for being rude, but nitwits like Zakir Naik and his monkey gang have ‘proved’ otherwise. Now I know that the western translations of the Vedas, on which these idiots rely on, are flawed. So don’t you think people with the actual knowledge of Vedas and Sanskrit should come forward and refute those claims? Sadly, it seems no one is interested! Here are a few examples. For more you can google ‘contradictions in Vedas’
http://www.topix.com/forum/religion/hindu/TTF4DU99P2NODJOPF
http://books.google.co.in/books?id=fz6KBkgEacAC&pg=PA522&lpg=PA522&dq=contradictions+in+vedas&source=bl&ots=o9tQBHeXib&sig=5rwibFHfr9kcclGZjLe30lKI3TY&hl=en&ei=w1FUSrjeNqjW6gO76-TLBw&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=6
http://in.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20090418185608AAowsd0
In the second link, Mr.Deshpande claims that if there is any contradiction found, it is because of the limitations of the mind. Now sorry, but that is a lame excuse. Some Hindus also claim that the Bible and Quran also have contradictions. But that doesn’t make the Vedas perfect, does it? Moreover, that dumb Zakir Naik has somehow by virtue of his theatrics managed to convince some fools that the Quran is scientifically flawless. I personally call the Quran a fairy tale, albeit a pathetic and unethical one.
I’d be grateful to you if you smash off all those so-called contradictions scientifically. Please create a new page for that.
You mentioned that the God ‘s word cannot be tampered and so on. That is absolutely true. But then, some researches have also shown that the Vedas aren’t as original as they ought to be.
Regards
1. I never claimed that Geeta and Vedas have no contradictions. Geeta is a later dated text and derives essence from Vedas. Many portions of Geeta, the way they are commonly interpreted, do contradict Vedic concepts and are not pramaans. Many scholars try to interpret them in a different manner. Others consider them as later day interpolations. Whatever be the reality, a study of Ishopanishad, which is primarily 40th Chapter of Yajurved, contains the essence of Geeta.
2. The so-called contradictions in Vedas are based upon the translations done by western scholars like Griffith etc. They are completely trash. Refer to translation of Vedas as provided by Dayanand Saraswati, and you will realise how foolish are these claims of contradictions. No one ever could show any contradiction based on any translation except those by Griffith et al. This is similar to one citing any mantra in front of those who do not know Sanskrit, and giving whatever interpretation they feel like giving – then claiming it to be full of mistakes!
3. Zakir Naik has been challenged several times by our team. You can see some videos in youtube.com/truthwisdom2008 as well. But he is smart not to choose tougher opponents.
4. The allegations on Vedas being not original are unfound. They simply claim that on basis of difference in language in different parts of Vedas. However, these have also been long refuted.
5. I agree that this campaign for propagating right meaning of Vedas and dispelling doubts should happen more aggressively. The only limitation is lack of funds and resources for such activities. Our fellow beings do not see these things as important priority and all that happens in this aspect is largely through individual initiatives. Dr Naik has a multi-storeyed office in Mumbai with millions of dollars flowing for his activities.
Nonetheless, the fight is on, and if efforts continue with best intentions, things would change for sure very soon, for better.
Dhanyavad
Asalamoalaikum bro i read what u wrote abt dr zakir naik and quran. .wel bro first of al i wud lyk to asure you that whatever he speaks has clear refrences nd translation if yov have doubts u cn urself verify it reading it in vedas of any of the translation, ,i myself have vedas whci i got frm my teacher wen i was in dav public schol. .nd regarding quran i wud lyk to say that plz tel any 1 unscientefic or wrng statdment. .bro indeed i feel proud that hnduism has sme buk which tel that none is to be worship but 1 true god ishwar or allah. .
@Rashid
Vedas do talk of worshipping one God only, but unlike Quran, it doesnt force one to believe in a chain of revelations and prophets, nor any sort of God agents.
Zakir Naik, misinterprets the Vedic verses. His references may be right, but his explanations of Vedic verses are so childish, and hence wrong.
well brother alhumdullilah[praise to allah]
i have no objection in agreeing that vedas too speak about only one god ,and i do agree that it does not foce any one to follow chains of revelation of prophets and message by god to the prophets…
but you wud agree that vedas do speaks about rishis ,or teacher which is some what same as our beliefs of messenger or prophet ..
according to quran every nation ,even every kaum or tribe when deviated from path was sent a messenger …and final messenger was sent to the land of arabs when they were in darkness of idol worship and cruel beliefs lyk killin og galzz,or being drunken..
there fore vedas may be [coz its name is not mentioned in quran] i wud lyk to say that it was the revelation of almighty allah.,god,parmeshwar…..
and it too speaks that a narashansa [praised worthy] will come ,the antim rishi to guide people to the truth…
and narashansa clearly mathes to the meaning of prophet muhammaf that is praised worthy…
also regarding why didnt god revealed the whole words at the begining it self i wud lyk to say that if he wud have been revealed the words at the tym of manu or adam in muslim beliefs he cud not have understood.. since the one who even didnt knew how to stitch clothes how cud he understan the concept of big bang,,thats y he revealed the words step by step //and finally he revealed the glorious quran confirming the truth about all previous revelation which came to diffrent parts of wold to different rishis or prophets even vedas if they r gods word……i cant not surely say coz the name vedas by name is not mentioned in quran..
you can see chapter prophet verse 30 which describe big bang theory..
even jesus [pbuh] said in gospel of john that “i have many things to tell you but u cant bear them now ,why not the spirit of truth , the comforter shall come so he guides you to all the truth”
here jesus was mentioning about the final prophet .comfortor and the truth is the words of god,ishwar or allah…
now you may ask that if god has revealed the words as per the situation and tme to tym..
then it might be possible that he may reveal sme book in future…??
well my answer is simple no..
coz quran confirms it….
and also quran has already confirmed all the truths in the form of verses which people may come to know in future ..
infact in future god will not send any prophet or revelations but will show signs so people may come to know the truth..
“Soon will We show them
Our Signs in the (furthest)
regions (of the earth), and
in their own souls, until
it becomes manifest to them
that this is the Truth
it is not enough that
Thy Lord doth witness
all things?”
[Al-Qur’an 41:53
so no need to worry humans shall come to know many things in future..
also the reason for sending revelations is that by the passage of tym words of god weer changed ,lyk u can say interpolated..
for eg bible or ingeel was fabricated by telling that jesus is allah or people of moses becoming hypocrytes even more which you too shall agree...
even there r contradictions in veds and hindu scriptures [if you want i can quote] but you might be knowing..
so people fabricated them so for confirming the truth about all revelations quran the final message was revealed..
also it is a historical fact that quran has never been fabricated…
also regarding dr naik translation about vedas and his explanation its always right..
if he was wrong sri ravishankar wud have told it…
and if you have sme other translation or explanation please tell me bro coz i too have gone thru the explanation by dr naik…and i didnt found any mistake..
also islam is universal religion to be practised .it is not based on sme person or material entity lyk christianity[follower of christ], or budhism[ follower of budha] or judaism[rel of jews] or
hinduism[people living near river indu]..our religion is not lyk muhamadism or muhamadanity
but rather it implies peace and submission of the will to god..
what can be the best religion of god rather being the religion of peace and submission…
and the follower is muslim [one who has submitted the will to god,ishwar, allah]
you may ques to me about the terrorist activities and muslims,osama.,mughal like babar.etc..
i wud simply say every community have sme black sheeps…why r u lookin at few fools and neglecting all other good muslim…if u r good person u will never say that all muslims r bad and all hindus r nice coz u urself know that it is not lyk that…
peace and submission the way to god and the best religion to which you will also agree..
alhumdullillah..
allah haviz bro ..take care..
@Rashid
brother, may peace be with you as well.
brother, all of Naik’s claims have been proven false on this site, please read all the articles relating to Zakir Naik. There is no mention of prophet Mohammad in Vedas, because Vedas never ever prophecize nor they tell history. Zakir Naik clearly twists verses and makes his own meanings up.
@Rashid masood
Namaste brother,
You would like to agree to 10 points given below, which will make sure that you are a human and are worth considering for intellectual debates and are not a terrorist like Babur, Aurangjeb, Zakir Naik, Osama, and Kasab.
a. It is not necessary that all non-Muslims, regardless of their good deeds, will burn in Hell forever.
b. It is not necessary that a criminal would go to Heaven simply because he surrenders to Quran and Islam and says a ‘sorry’!. So all those terrorists who kill, rape or loot in name of Islam would go to Hell and should be openly condemned by Muslims regardless of their religion. Allah will not forgive rapists, killlers, and looters at any cost.
c. A woman is not bereft of intelligence or half-intelligent compared to men as claimed in several verses of Quran/ Hadiths. Allah allows women the same social, legal and political opportunities in life that He endows to men. (Refer entire series on Women in Islam )
d. The concept of Jazia tax on non-Muslims is disgusting. Social, political and criminal regulations should be same for everyone regardless of religion.
e. The English translations of Quran by likes of Yusuf Ali, Pickthall, Dawood; Tafseers of Sahih International, Jalalyn; Sahih Bukhari, Sahih Muslim as published by Islamic publishers and websites suffer from discrepancies and DO NOT correctly represent Islam.
Because these are the only translations which are used for questioning Islam. The Muslim debaters would refuse to admit that these translations are wrong (because Islam forbids them to condemn other Muslims) but yet try to allege that anti-Islamic material is used to demean Islam!
The fact is that ONLY Islamic texts published by Islamic publishers is used to question Islam, be it by Agniveer or by Faith Freedom or by Islam Watch etc. So if there is anything objectionable in sources cited by those questioning Islam, the ‘experts’ should clearly state that they reject the authenticity of the sources even if it is an Islamic publication.
f. The Sahih (True) Hadiths (sayings of Muhammad) which talk of rape of war victims, or killing children and other disgusting things (refer Zakir Naik claims Islam – The ONLY Practical Religion of World! and Practical Islam – Science of Hygiene ) are wrong and NOT part of Islam.
g. A Muslim who could not find Islam addressing his questions and converts to another religion does not require to be killed for apostasy as per Islamic laws, even if he propagates his new religion. Those who KILL apostates or justify their killing in Islamic state are greatest criminals. (Refer Zakir Naik – the mentor of terrorists)
h. All those Muslim rulers like Babur who admit in their own biography of indulging into pedophilia, homosexuality, cutting thousands of head, narcotics and keeping harem of women are not actually Muslims but disgrace in name of Islam. (Refer Babri Masjid demolition – Symbol of Hindu-Muslim unity )
i. All those clerics, organizations and countries that call for constant war against non-Muslims are against Islam and criminals. For example refer to following fatwa issued from Saudi Arabia:
Fatwa_It is Obligatory for Non-Muslims to Accept ISLAM
j. Non-Muslims should have the same rights to propagate their beliefs in Islamic countries, (so far the beliefs are not criminal, immoral and violent) as Muslims have the right to propagate Islam in non-Islamic countries. But if Muslims believe that it is against Islam to allow preaching of any other religion in Islamic countries, then they should also stop propagating Islam in other countries.
For further reading, refer http://agniveer.com/2623/islam-will-not-be-a-threat-if/#comment-8477
I hope you agree to these points so that we can continue with the discussion.
asalamoalaikum bro..
well bro while naming terrorist why u only mentioned the names of muslims..
u forgot the name of famous hindu sadhvi pragya …
and also raj thakre,baal thakre……and all the hindu supporters…
and quote me ny one good reason y u wrote the name of dr zakir naik …
Namaste @rashid masood bro..
Pragya thakur is an exception ..that too an exception who lost a colleague to Islamist terrorism.
She is no doubt wrong in what she was trying to do ..but the core reason for her becoming what she became is again Islamic Violence.
you want to call hindu supporters as terrorists ..isn;t that great ?
by that logic ..anybody who says all muslims are terrorists must also be right ..right?
@rashid
What pragya thakur has done is not Hindu terrorism, its just the revenge for the innocent people who are dying coz of islamic terrorism. You may say it Hindu Revolution. Ofcourse its totally wrong, but you can’t help it, victims of islamic terrorism are increasing day by day. If islamic terrorism is not stopped muslims can expect more number attacks like that. Its has nothing to do with hinduism. For more understanding watch movie “Wednesday” and read this article too http://www.faithfreedom.org/articles/islamic-jihad-articles/hindu-terrorism-myth-or-reality/
An Addendum : Reality of Malegaon
In Malegaon its only hindu Prostitutes that are safe as they have nothing to loose ! Such is the face of Islam there. Being a muslim majority place hindus are 2nd grade citizen there, forget about the dignity of hindu women !!
Let the wise decide if it was terrorism or fight for self-respect ! But the impotent congressmen, for their vote-bank termed it as Hindu-Terrorism !
RASHID MASOOD everybody in MUMBAI knows that who controls the Mumbai Home Ministry it is Dawood otherwise Colonel Purohit who is a brilliant officer of Military Intelligence who trained ATS to catch terrorist, how will he do a silly mistake like using their own motorcycle for bomb blast, he must have clearly know the fact that even after big bomb blast bike’s Chasis number will be intact through it even a local constable can catch the suspect.
Even a Muslim Journalist the author of BLACK FRIDAY have exposed Sharad Pawar’s NCP link with Dawood.
All Terrorists are Muslims…Except the 99.6% that Aren’t. For all statements of agniveer, there is a rebuttal and extremely logical reply given by Truth of Hinduism.com. I recommend everyone out here to visit this site, study and analysis issues by your ownself to know who is speaking truth and who is lying. Regarding Jehad pls visit website: http://www.loonwatch.com/2010/01/terrorism-in-europe/. These are the facts and figures found by non-muslims.
might as well redirect the people to these fact based sites
http://www.jihadwatch.com
http://www.thereligionofpeace.com
this gives a better day by day account of the ‘peace’ that is spreading in the whole world
bro i too dont want to drag the names of hindus..i know that religion shud not be judged by the followers ..iknow thats y i dont relate it to any religion.but u forced me….y dont you people stick only to terrorism rather saying islamic terrorism….
jihaad in quran only refers to jihaad al fisabillilah..
and i m proud to be called a mujahid in that context..that is striving for rite cause in the way of lord….
striving in the way of god for right cause…only right cause…
and i tell u if any one kills or terrifies a masoom or innocent is never a muslim though he/she claims…
and regarding pragya..i am with her if she fights against terrorism..but she is against whole islam… she tries only to resemble islam with terrorism..trying to degrade and rise false allegation against it…she can win over terrorism in the way dr zair naik is doing that is conducting peace conference…and not rising false accusation on ny religion….
Rashid Masood Brother why would anybody use his own motorbike for terrorist activities even suicide bombers do not use their own bikes. When ATS nabs some muslim terrorist then all human rights case are lodged against them or tell that accused are falsely implicated but when ATS catches a Hindu guy for political reasons then same Muslim leaders never tell these guy is falsely implicated or any lack of proof then ATS becomes hero.
AgniVeer
Thank you so much for your reply. I won’t hesitate to say that your answers have managed to convince me to quite an extent. Besides, I found a discussion where some of those alleged contradictions have been addressed and rebutted. Now although I ain’t sure if their answers are absolutely true, they make a lot of sense and they’re enough to prove the idiocy and treachery of Naik and his followers. [P.S. The forum also contains many abuses. Please ignore those.] Some contradictions have been handled by user ‘Ranul’ on pg.1 and more by user ‘A concerned Hindu’ on pg.3
http://www.topix.com/forum/religion/hindu/TTF4DU99P2NODJOPF
So it does appear that the contradictions are actually parts of a conspiracy. I’m glad I didn’t fall into the trap!
Can you answer this basic question please? I looked for the answer all over the net but I couldn’t find satisfactory answers. Many confusions:
Is Sanatan Dharma polytheistic, monotheistic, monist, atheistic, agnostic or pantheistic?
My little reading till now tells me that this grand religion is a combination of all these forms. I’ll elaborate. Please comment or correct me if required:
The basic premise is that Sanatan Dharma(SD) is not averse to any form of worship as a beginning. One can be mono or poly as desired; even atheistic(like Jains) or agnostic(Buddhists)
However, future enhancements ultimately take you to the absolute consciousness or Brahman or Godhead. It generally goes like: poly/atheistic/agnostic–>mono–>monist. Monism also correctly explains the creation of the universe, and not as something created out of nothing by the Abrahamic religions.
Further, monism proves that the ‘Gods’ like Rama, Krishna, Ganesha and even Allah and Jesus for that matter are graded manifestations of this Brahman. But the most important point is that these people were actually humans in the beginning and became elevated souls to acquire supernatural or rather mystical powers by meditation. So it is safe to say that these Gods can err, lie and most importantly they have limited powers.
So it is not wrong to say that SD ultimately is monist.
If one goes by this assumption, most of the queries, especially those of atheists can be solved. The only pre-requirement would be a proof that indeed the Vedas, especially the Rig Veda are absolutely the way they were in say, 0 AD. But then:
http://hinduism.suite101.com/article.cfm/the_atharva_veda
This site says the Atharva Veda isn’t much reliable. But the best part is that I didn’t find any information that the Rig Veda is tampered. Great!
I’m sorry if I’ve hurt you in my previous message but trust me I’m a sincere seeker of truth and I suppose constructive criticism and questioning is allowed in the Vedic religion, unlike the organized ones, the Abrahamic religions.
Namaste and greetings
Kedar
Let me clear and upfront on this. All Vedas unequivocally consider Ishwar to be one and one alone. No mantra is Vedas can be considered as even silent approval of polytheism. Further Vedas consider soul to be different from ishwar. Vedas consider three eternal entities – Ishwar, soul and nature (mass-energy duo). There is no fourth entity and all souls are equal in all aspects. There are no super souls and normal souls. Its only the efforts put by soul which bring him close to Ishwar. Thus souls vary only in this aspect. Further Vedas also claim that unless you believe something to be the way it is, you are bound to face troubles. Thus worship of Ishwar only in the manner He is – One, Omnipresent, Omniscient, All Powerful, Unborn, Undying, Just, Merciful, Blissful, Pure, Eternal etc etc. Worship of Ishwar in only this form can bear any benefits.
The rest of the cults – Hinduism (Hindu is a later dated word), Buddhism, Jainism etc came much later after the Vedic Dharma got much degraded. They all focussed on certain aspects of Vedic Dharma but ignored other. Thus they could not present a complete picture and had inherent defects and contradictions. Many of their practices were against Vedas/ actual truth. And hence following these led us to several problems. For example, Hinduism became polytheist and indulged in idol-worship. Now Vedas clearly say that He does not have an Idol. Ram/Krishna/ Shankara etc were legendary role models who reached greatest heights of perfection. When they died, stories were created to make them actual Ishwars. If you read these stories, as in Purans, your head would hang in shame. These stories continued to be added till late 19th Century. Thus we even have story of Queen Victoria and Prophet in Bhavishya Puran. However many of the propagators of Dharma over various periods of time were smart enough to ensure that one clause was inserted in all Dharmic texts of Hindus – that Vedas are ultimate truth. Any thing in contradiction to Vedas is worth rejection. Since Vedas themselves were ignored, the question of rejection did not come. In fact malpractices began in name of Vedas. In opposition, cults like Jainsim and Buddhism started. They denied authority of Vedas without actually reading them. However, the basic essence of Vedas, which was part of culture here, was always imbibed in our social norms, habits and behaviors. Similar is case with Islam and Christianity. They all emerged due to combination of problems in contemporary society, opportunism and ignorance of Vedas.
This can become a very long discussion. But have just given a summary. If you are keen to know more details, I can give you references. On matter of Vedas, there is absolutely no confusion with regards to Athavaveda, Yajurveda and Samaveda at all. Not even of a syllable. For Atharvaveda, some claims do come of it not being authentic. But even that is unfound and primarily due to confusion with regards to interpretation of Vedic words. Maybe I should prepare one article on this subject itself. You can refer to http://www.satyavidya.org/must-read/unchangeable-vedas for a good article on this. http://www.satyavidya.org may be a good site to answer many more queries. Especially http://www.satyavidya.org/must-read
I am happy that you have a questioning attitude and would like it to come out even more emphatically, so far it is for genuine quest for truth. Religions claim that spiritualism begins where logic ends. Vedas say that one cannot even think of reaching God without logic. The triumvirate of Knowedge, Actions and Devotion is necessary to reach Truth.
It’s nice to hear that the Vedas are intact even today.
One last question:
Is there any concept of hell and heaven in any of the Vedas, or it’s just a figment of imagination from the Puranas? There have been claims that the Atharva Veda does mention hell. Or I guess there might be a wrong translation of something probably close to the word ‘Naraka’. May be that particular word in Atharva Veda in Sanskrit means something else. Please clarify if possible.
If you insist that the Vedas contain the mention of hell, then it would be a contradiction to the concept of re-incarnation, which I know is the heart of the eastern religions.
And please also recommend to me who’s concepts of Vedas should I refer to, unless I probably learn Sanskrit myself. Maharishi Aurobindo, Swami Vivekananda, Dayananda Saraswati, Sayana, Shankaracharya or someone else? I’m told that some of their interpretations were different from one another.
The concept of hell and heaven, as popularly understood is merely a figment of imagination – an imagination that has cost us heavily in history. Swarga (Heaven) is the enjoyment of extreme happiness and the attainment of the means thereof. Narka (Hell) is another name for undergoing extreme suffering and possession of the means thereof. They do not refer to any distant locations where some gods drink and enjoy dance of apsara or yamraaj sits on a buffalo.
Of the people you have mentioned, only Sayana, Aurobindo and Dayanand have produced interpretations. Sayana interpretation is full of flaws. This was done ignorin root meaning of words. Aurobindo himself has claimed that no one can come close to Dayanand in correct interpretation of Vedas. Thus Dayanand's interpretation is exemplaray. Vivekanand was a popular orator and writer, but neither an expert in Sanskrit and Vedas nor a yogi. His writings are good in language but full of contradictions and examples of weakness of character. Shankaracharya was a great scholar but his works are misunderstood these days. I would suggest you first read 'Satyarth Prakash' and 'Rigvedadibhashyabhumika' by Dayanand Saraswati and gain a good grasp of concepts. Then you can proceed with Dayanand's translations. In fact once you analyse the previous two books, you can take any translation and would be able to catch any flaws in them. I hope it helps! Om
//I would suggest you first read 'Satyarth Prakash' and 'Rigvedadibhashyabhumika' by Dayanand Saraswati and gain a good grasp of concepts.///
Is there any online link to above resources. ?
Visit <a href="http://www.satyavidya.org” target=”_blank”>www.satyavidya.org . Please read the section called 'Fundamentals of Vedas'. Also download Satyarth prakash from the downloads section. You can also get Satyarth Prakash and Rigvedadibhashyabhumika (Introduction to Vedas) from <a href="http://www.geocities.com/athens/ithaca/3440/books…” target=”_blank”>http://www.geocities.com/athens/ithaca/3440/books...
you can find satyarth prakash and other books written by Maharshi Dayanand here.
http://www.aryasamajjamnagar.org/
Agniveerji you are doing very very good job…No words to praise your task…
Very Nice piece of writing on clearing the misconception on Vedas.
your quote
///The suktas on which a particular Rishi meditated is referred with that Rishi’s name. So Rishi are Mantra-Drashta and not Mantra-Rachayita (They are seers and not creators of Mantras)///
This is perfect, i am saying this again and again to many that Suktas are cosmic vibration , the ultimate truth which are continuously flowing in the universe and Rishi discovered them and wrote them for the common man. These sutra can again be realised if anyone is qualified for it or reaches its qualification through practice.
for eg Gravity is present before Newton but he coined it.
Keep it up!
Thankyou,
Best Wishes,
Vijay Goel
astrologer
Jaipur.
You are very right. Also unless one becomes such an enlightened Yogi through practice, one cannot understand the complete essence of mantras. Hence, the first percondition to judge if someone can be good authority on Vedas is to assess how much Yogic is his life. I am referring to Yoga of Patanjali and not hatha yoga here!
Yes I agree with you. I hope to see more on this as a series.
All ancient aarsh texts and even new Purans consider Vedas as revealed knowledge. Even Vedas claim so.
Can you please provide the reference of the Veda mantra which claims this?
Kindly read Rigvedadibhashyabhumika by Swami Dayanand. Dhanyavad
Hi Agniveer,
I love reading your posts..
All are superb and tries to clear the misconceptions about Vedas.
I have one doubt..
As per Ambedkar's "Riddles in Vedas" , :-
Vedas(Rig, Atharvana..) says that Vedas were created by Indra, Sometimes another Veda says that it was by Time…etc and so on.
The link for The Ambedkar's Riddles is:
http://www.ambedkar.org/riddleinhinduism/21A2.Rid…
Now a days many Islam/Dalit/Christian websites are using it to prove that whole Vedas(inturn Hinduism) is full of contradictions and are false..
Can you please provide answers for Ambedkar's Riddles?
Or is Ambedkar's Riddles unanswerable??
I'm sorry if my following question hurts you!!!
But I need answers for Ambedkar's Riddles as many of the Islamic websites uses it to prove Vedas wrong!!
Thanks for pointing that out. I shall try to answer that very soon.
Dhanyavad
You never can point out or show true for false is false and true is true. never cant mix up the true and false.
@Phiroj
1)Kuran is full of contradictions. Kuran says Allah is omnipresent but Again says Allah sits on 7th sky and Mohamad was going to 7th sky in search of Allah.
2) Kuran says Allah is absoluter but which Allah is absoluter, the Allah who was idly sitting alone till the billion of years before universe inception & was suffering from loneliness or the second Allah who suddenly got the idea of creation of universe. Who is perfect, choose one.
simple, there is not a single contradiction in qur’an, Allah is one who is forever and muhammad(pbuh) will sit on highest heaven which is made by Allah(swt). where is contradiction ?
@Phiroj
Which Allah between two- is absoluter ? Allah is omnipresent=Allah sits on 7th sky. Mohamad had to go on 7th sky in search of Allah (contradiction).
http://agniveer.com/1948/vedas-myths-misconceptions/#comment-20225
In the" Riddles of Hinduism" book, the critics have missed these comments of Dr.Ambedkar:
http://www.ambedkar.org/riddleinhinduism/21C.Ridd…
"The Hindu social system is undemocratic not by accident. It is designed to be undemocratic. Its division of society into varnas and castes, and of castes and outcastes are not theories but are decrees. They are all barricades raised against democracy.
From this it would appear that the doctrine of fraternity was unknown to the Hindu Religious and Philosophic thought. But such a conclusion would not be warranted by the facts of history. The Hindu Religious and Philosophic thought gave rise to an idea which had greater potentialities for producing social democracy than the idea of fraternity. It is the doctrine of Brahmaism*. ….The essence of Brahmaism is summed up in a dogma which is stated in three different forms. They are (i) Sarvam Khalvidam Brahma— All this is Brahma. (ii) Aham Brahmasmi— Atmana (Self) is the same as Brahma.
Therefore I am Brahma. (iii) Tattvamasi— Atmana (Self) is the same as Brahma.
Therefore thou art also Brahma. ……..It may well be that Brahma is unknowable. But all the same this theory of Brahma has certain social implications which have a tremendous value as a foundation for Democracy. If all persons are parts of Brahma then all are equal and all must enjoy the same liberty which is what Democracy means. Looked at from this point of view Brahma may be unknowable. But there cannot be slightest doubt that no doctrine could furnish a stronger foundation for Democracy than the doctrine of Brahma.
To support Democracy because we are all children of God is a very weak foundation for Democracy to rest on. That is why Democracy is so shaky wherever it made to rest on such a foundation. But to recognize and realize that you and I are parts of the same cosmic principle leaves room for no other theory of associated life except democracy. It does not merely preach Democracy. It makes democracy an obligation of one and all.
Western students of Democracy have spread the belief that Democracy has stemmed either from Christianity or from Plato and that there is no other source of inspiration for democracy. If they had known that India too had developed the doctrine of Brahmaism which furnishes a better foundation for Democracy they would not have been so dogmatic. India too must be admitted to have a contribution towards a theoretical fouodation for Democracy."
Note: The criticism is of "Hindu social system" and not Vedas/Hinduism per se.
typo mistake..
I'm sorry if my following question hurts you!!!
should be:
I'm sorry if my above question hurts you!!!
Analysis of truth never hurts. It only paves the path towards bliss!
You have to come in Islam because beda and purana mentioned in that
Don’t think you are knower of all… Do you know what is the meaning of Akhila ???? It means all…. If you have to replace a single word for all the 99 names of Allah, it is Akhila in Sanskrit. So Mohammed was saying about me when he said 99 names of Allah… So Qoran sys I am the supreme of All. So you have to come to me… Qoran says so…
how stupid
@Phiroj
Then what about Jakir naik claim Mohamad name in Purans. Akhila said the same.
@anand
bro..
You said "The criticism is of "Hindu social system" and not Vedas/Hinduism per se. "
But he has written Riddles in Hinduism in which he has wriiten riddles on Vedas…
I have no idea on Vedas.. But for his Riddles of Rama & Krishna… I am preparing answers and I will answer it soon..
Only for his riddles on Vedas I am not able to answer since I am new to Vedas..
So I request anyone from Arya Samaj to answer that ,since arya samaj is the only authentic source for Vedas!
I'm worried because many islamic websites are using his riddles to defame hinduism..
By looking at his riddles of Rama & Krishna I was able to understand that he has just relied on unauthentic source and western Indologists books.. So I am preparing Answers for his riddles of Rama & Krishna.. but for Riddles in Vedas I hv no idea!!
Its time we must unite and provide rebuttals to all defaming articles wriiten against Hinduism(which is written mostly by considering Western Indologists books)..
A great article this is for all ignorant people(Im talking about hindus too), I regret studying vedas (I seriously feel this is the impact of our Parents and Grandparents(who believed more in the western preachings), Its time for us to fix this I appreciate ur work ..Keep writing
vedas are very difficult to understand, and any person can misunderstand it….it can only be understood by a pure devotee of lord Krishna and can be explained by him only….read A.C. bhaktivedanta swami prabhupada ji's Bhagavad gita as it is…..on prabhupadabooks.com and visit Krishna.org…..
Main Purpose of Vedas was to elevate human society from animal consciousness to God consciousness
and ultimate aim or purpose of a Living being is to attain causeless trancedental service and love of Lord Krishna, that's it!! read all the books translated by AC bhaktivedanta swami prabhupadaji online….i hope it helps:)
@Tushar
Brother, how were Vedas being understood when there was no lord krishna and thus no devotee of him? Shri Krishna himself was devotee of Parameshvar and used to worship a formless God mentioned in Vedas. You can find his true character in Mahabharat.
Hi Agniveer ji….
Recently I came across a Islamic Website. There they are propagating false about Maharshi Dayanand Saraswati.
Please go through this link :
http://aaiil.org/text/books/others/durrani/swamid…
I think that this author (KHAN DURRANI) needs to be answered..
Everywhere muslims are circulating this one.
Please give rebuttals to this stupid KHAN DURRANI…..
is god formless?? or he has forms
VEDAS IS THE ONLY ONLY ONLY ONLY SCRIPTURE WHICH WORSHIP THE TRUE SUPREME GOD.
The Abrahamic Religions like Jews, Christians , Muslims are only worshiping PLANETARY GODS AND BABYLON/EGYPTIAN GODS using exotic names. Only Planetary gods have Sabbath like SUN-DAY, SATURDAY, AND FRIDAY.
………..mr agniveer states that………The difference in Quran and Vedas are manifold:
a. Quran was revealed few hundred years ago. Even foreign so-called scholars believe Vedas to be first texts of mankind. A revealed text must be revealed at beginning of creation and not in between.
my reply:
well mr agniveer forgot to notice that vedas r so old ,hence more chance of fabrication..it was never being recorded that vedas were learnt by heart ,i dont know even a single man on this earth who is by heart wid vedas..not a single.. ..so it is highly possible that it is fabricated or changed …on the other hand quran from the begining was learnt by the people of arabs by heart hence no chance of fabrication…unlike brahman who only use to read and practise vedas…. quran was read and practised by all muslims in their daily life and hence no chance of fabrication….by raising the point that vedas r first words or revelation of god u can gain nothing but proof of adulteration or fabrication in vedas…
b. Quran is written in Arabic, a language specfic to a geography. Vedas are in vedic Sanskrit which is mother of all languages of world today
my ans:
well i dont know by raising this point wat does agniveer want to quote..wat he means that god can only send his message in mother of all toungues but not in other foriegn langauge..
c. Quran contains location specfic descriptions and customs. Vedas contain no geography or history
my ans:
this indeed can be called as a drawback of vedas not containing knowledge about place and how does god sent his message to different parts of world..it doesnot quote ny thing..
while quran tell that every tribe when deviated was sent a messenger and a book containing laws..
d. Quran beleives itself to be final edition of God’s message. Now first, God’s message, by definition, has to be flawless and not subject to modifications. And if indeed modifications are necessary in God’s message, then there can be no FINAL edition. The process should then continue.
Vedas on other hand are one and same – they cannot be altered, contain fundamental truths. Their applicability may change depending in times. But the core rules are always applicable.
my ans:
well mr agniveer if you wanted to become an eng y u studied class 1,2,3 then cleared graduation..why didnt u went directly for graduation..
if god wud have revealed quran at the time of adam[pnuh] or manu in ur religion he wud have not understood coz the man who even didnt knew how to stitch clothes how can he understand the concept of creation of world lyk big bang theory…..so god revealed only the things which he cud bear and finally confirming all truth..i repeat only truth… thru muhammad[pbuh] in quran..u can refer surah 22 :30 for big bang theory..the basic laws of living and morality always remained same..
none of revelation god allah abrogate[change or cancel ] but he substitute something better or similar.” alquran 2.106.
.now regarding if god shall reveal some other book, let me tell u bro quran testifies every truth and there will not come any prophet or messenger to testify the quran or to confirm quran but indeed allah swt will show us signs so that we may believe that this book is the truth and from almity ishwar,parmatma or allah… “Soon will We show them
Our Signs in the (furthest)
regions of universe and earth, and
in their own souls, until
it becomes manifest to them
that this is the Truth.
it is not enough that
Thy Lord doth witness
all things?”
[Al-Qur’an 41:53
so no need to worry ,,humans shall come to know many things in future..
and after seeing the signs people will glorify that yes this quran is realy a divine book from god ..lyk prof keeth moore and other scientist glorify islam ,muhammad [pbuh] and quran after knowing about the scientefic aspects of quran..
also the reason for sending revelations is that by the passage of tym words of books were changed ,lyk u can say interpolated or fabricated..
for eg bible or ingeel was fabricated by telling that jesus is allah or people of moses becoming hypocrytes even more which you too shall agree…
even there r contradictions in vedAs and hindu scriptures [if you want i can quote] but you might be knowing..
so people fabricated them so for confirming the truth about all revelations quran the final message was revealed..even vedas if they r gods word ,, i m saying if the were since vedas by name is no where mentioned in quran..so might be a revelation..and whether it be ..but now quran has to be followed…
e. A revealed text should contain source of all possible knowledge. Only Vedas pass this litmus test.
my ans :
sry i already quoted that vedas does not give all answer..now tell where does vedas speak about creation of heavens and the earth[universe] in such a manner lyk quran….or where does vedas speak about embroylogy and sex determination lyk quran.. or where does vedas say that this universe is expanding lyk quran speaks..where does vedas speak that what happened to the people of other parts of world ,,how god sent his message to the people of other lands….quran tells all these things..
f. Vedas can not be altered at all. Many editions of Quran exist
my answer:
well here mr agniveer i want to say that quran is in foriegn language..and many arabic words r ambiguous and depends how one use..for eg deen in surah fateha means judgement but in later part of quran it means religion ..even the word dahaha can be considered..
and we muslim have no objection in considering these ambiguous statements and verses..even quran testifies this in surah alimraan chap3:7 that for there r two sets of passages in quran one clear and others ambiguous[having more than one meaning] and the one wid little faith wud use that meaning for creating fasaad..u mr agniveer is indeed a fasadi trying to fool people by twisting the verses of quran and placing them out of context…though you know that how true the book itself is….
so translation of quran r not wrong but you can say that allah means more than what we have translated..and arabic version is all same…
and the reason for using ambigous statement i feel is that the verses of quran can be applicable at all ages..
consider the word dahaha for earth ..it may means as wide expanse or as an egg shaped..
when man at mid age saw earth he thought it to be as an expanse[faila hua] but now we know it is egg shaped , geospherical and hence find no objection in considering second meaning of dahaha also.even the meaning expanse is right since earth look like expanse…eg expanded ball….
g. Quran was started by Prophet Muhammad – his personal life exemplifies his character!
my ans:
quran is truly gods word ,,prophet [pbuh] was an illiterate ..the scientefic facts itself testifies it.. how can an illiterate cud speak so pure and fine arabic litterature and how can he tell so big scietefic facts..nay ,never he can..but indeed this is not prophet muhammad[pbuh] who tells but allah ,the almity god ,the parmatma….
allah haviz..
@rashid masood
Namaste Brother,
Please visit http://agniveer.com/2623/islam-will-not-be-a-threat-if/ and give your clear views on the ten points raised there. We can discuss philosophy with you only after you agree with those points.
i will insha allah….
but you too have to agree the refutations by me..from these points none of u can run..
i will insha allah discuss all the 10 points which mr agniveer has raised….
wait for sme days till i get internet connection at my home….
allah haviz..
Well! dear friend
You have already said that and almost prove that islamic texts are not fabricated till now yes indeed it is true
You give answer to the question that Sanskrit is mother of all Language but there is no difference
in god’s view of language.
But then will you let me know why muslim scholars say that arabic is the base to get allah
and kuran is full of decet and violence
Why Mohammed was not a prophet:
One who claims to be a messenger of God is expected to live a saintly life. He must not be given to lust, he must not be a sexual pervert, and he must not be a rapist, a highway robber, a war criminal, a mass murderer or an assassin. One who claims to be a messenger of God must have a superior character. He must stand above the vices of the people of his time. Yet Muhammad’s life is that of a gangster godfather. He raided merchant caravans, looted innocent people, massacred entire male populations and enslaved the women and children. He raped the women captured in war after killing their husbands and told his followers that it is okay to have sex with their captives and their “right hand possessions” (Quran 33:50) He raped kid and slave.He assassinated those who criticized him and executed them when he came to power and became de facto despot of Arabia. Muhammad was bereft of human compassion. The prophet Muhammad sanctioned a temporary marriage—sigheh in Iran and muta’a in Iraq— which can provide a legitimizing cover
He was an obsessed man with his dreams of grandiosity and could not forgive those who stood in his way. Muhammad was a narcissist like Hitler, Saddam or Stalin. He was astute and knew how to manipulate people, but his emotional intelligence was less evolved than that of a 6-year-old child. He simply could not feel the pain of others. He brutally massacred thousands of innocent people and pillaged their wealth. His ambitions were big and as a narcissist he honestly believed he is entitled to do as he pleased and commit all sorts of crimes and his evil deeds are justified.
#
Why Quran is not from God:
Muhammad produced no miracles and when pressed he claimed that his miracle is the Quran. Yet a cursory look at the Quran reveals that this book is full of errors. Quran is replete with scientific heresies, historic blunders, mathematical mistakes, logical absurdities, grammatical errors and ethical fallacies. It is badly compiled and it contradicts itself. There is nothing intelligent in this book let alone miraculous. Muhammad challenged people to produce a “Surah like it” or find an error therein, yet Muslims would kill anyone who dares to criticize it. In such a climate of hypocrisy and violence truth is the first casualty.
The prophet Muhammad is known for his hatred towards Christians and Jews. He called them apes and pigs and ordered their slaughter and in one case he commaded his Mujahideen fighters to burn them with fire.
While Osama bin Zayd, preparing his troops to invade the Christian lands, the prophet Muhammad commanded him saying, “attack them in the darkness of the dawn and fall on them killing and burn them with fire and invade them and return with the booty.” Those words of the prophet Muhammad could be found in the most authentic Islamic books which are known as the Mothers of the Islamic Books and approved by Al-Azhar Al-Sharif University. Just to mention few of them (Ibn Habib in al-Mahabir p 117, Ibn Kathir in al-Bedaiah wa al-Nihaiah p 139, 143, Ibn Said al-Nas in ‘Auion al-Atharig p 145, al-Suhili in Rawd Alanif p 24, Ibn Hisham p 245, and al-Tabari in Tarikh al-Rusul wa al-Milook p 156).
Qur’an 5:17 “Verily they are disbelievers and infidels who say, ‘The Messiah, son of Mary, is God.”
Qur’an 5:51 “Believers, take not Jews and Christians for your friends. They are but friends and protectors to each other.”
Qur’an 9:29 “Fight those who do not believe in Allah or the Last Day, who do not forbid that which has been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, or acknowledge the Religion of Truth (Islam), (even if they are) People of the Book (Christians and Jews), until they pay the Jiziyah tribute tax in submission, feeling themselves subdued and brought low” [Another translation says] “pay the tax in acknowledgment of our superiority and their state of subjection.”
Bukhari: V5 hadith no. 727 “When Allah’s Apostle became seriously sick, he started covering his face with a woolen sheet. When he felt short of breath, he removed it, and said, ‘that is so! Allah’s curse be on Jews and Christians.’”
The Slaughter of the Jewish tribe of Bani Qurizah,
Muhammad: Oh brothers of monkeys and pigs
The trembling Jews replied: Oh Abu al-Qasim, you have not been a bad man!! (Ibid; 392, quoting from Ibn Kathir, al-Bedayia p. 120).
The prophet called out to them: Oh brothers of monkeys. Does Allah disappointed you and send on you his curse?
The Qurizah understood the message and replied in fear: Oh Abi al-Qasim, you have not been an ignorant man (Ibid, quoting from al-Bihaqi, al-Tarikh p. 582).
The Jews of Qurizah continued to plead with Muhammad `and beg him to send to them one of their allies, a man by the name of Abi Libabah bin Abd al-Nuziar al-Awasi.
When Abi Libabah entered their garrison, the men rose, the women wept, and the children cried to him. When he saw them he had pity on them.
They said to him: oh Abi Libabah, do you think we should go out for the judgment of Muhammad?
He said, yes, and then he passed his finger across his neck, which means, the slaughter.
Then their leader, Ka’ab bin Asaad said to his people: Let us follow Muhammad and believe in him.
They replied: We will not leave the judgment of the Torah forever.
He said to them: Then let us kill our children and women and go out to Muhammad.
They said: Shall we kill these harmless children and women? What is the good of life after them? (Al-Qimni 2004: 393-394, quoting from al-Tabari p. 583).
Finally the men of Bani Qurizah decided to go out and meet Muhammad hoping that the other Medinian tribes would intercede with the Prophet and request him to send them with their women and children out of Yathrib as he did before with the other two Jewish tribes. As soon as the Jewish men emerged out of their garrison, the prophet ordered his men to bind them with ropes and march them in a long queue (Ibid: 394, quoting from al-Tabari, al-Tarikh p. 583). Then the prophet asked his men to dig many ditches inside the city (Ibid). After so many pleadings from the leaders of the Medinian tribes of al-Khaziriq and al-Awas, Muhammad agreed that Sa’ad bin Mu’aaz should decide the fate of the Jews (Ibid, quoting from al-Tabari p. 586).
Al-Tabari narrated that Sa’ad bin Mu’aaz was dying. During the siege of the city, an arrow hit his hand and caused a cut on one of his nerves. The prophet tried to heal him by heating a nail and burning the nerve. In doing that Muhammad thought the bleeding would stop. However, the burning nail worsened the cut and caused the nerve to swell. When the Prophet repeated the same treatment the nerve exploded (Ibid: 395). In his dying state Sa’ad was carried to the Prophet. When Muhammad saw him he ordered the Jews to stand to their Master. “When Sa’ad was put down by his carriers the prophet asked him to judge on them. He said, I judge on them that the men should be put to death, their wealth divided, and their women distributed as jawari among the Muslims. The prophet said to him, you have judged on them with the judgment of Allah that has been given to you from seven heavens” (Ibid: 395, quoting al-Tabari, al-Tarikh p. 586).
The horrifying slaughter was described by al-Tabari as follows:
They brought first the enemy of Allah, Huaya bin Akhatab, while his hands were bound to his neck by a rope. (Huaya was the father of Safiya bint Huaya whom the Prophet killed her husband and brother and took her as his wife). When Huaya saw the Messenger of Allah, he said to him, I swear by God, I have never blamed myself for your enmity. Then, Huaya turned to the people and said, oh people there is no fear from the judgment and the Book of God, it is an honor written by God to the children of Israel to die as martyrs. Then, he sat down and his neck was beheaded… Ali bin Talib and al-Zibiar continued to strike their necks… It is assumed that their blood reached the oilstones that are at the market (Ibid: 396, quoting from al-Tabari, al-Tarikh pp. 588-589).
The narrators of the sira differed in the number of the Jewish men who were killed on that fateful day. Some said six hundred, some seven hundred, some eight hundred, and some nine hundred (Ibid: 396). Al-Qimni states, “And we learn from our heritage a new thing happened in that slaughter. The slaughter was not restricted to men only, but included little boys too” (Ibid: 398 referring to al-Tabari p. 591). Then the victims were buried in those big holes or ditches that the Muslims dug.
According to tradition, Muhammad would take a rota with his wives, sleeping with each in their turn. One night, during Hafsa’s turn, she asked to visit her father, and Muhammad granted her request. While she was gone, Muhammad took Mary the Coptic slave-girl and slept with her in Hafsa’s bed ( east, Hafsa is not there, someone else must satisfy him in Hafsa’s bed). Hafsa returned, was enraged, and confronted Muhammad. He promised (on oath) not to touch Mary again if she would keep this a secret, and then promised that her father Umar would be his successor after Abu Bakr (according to al-Sira al- Halabiyya, vol.2).
Hafsah, however, told Aisha of the incident, and for a full month Muhammad had no dealings with any of his wives, living with Mary alone. Aisha berated Muhammad for his deceit, whereupon Muhammad was finally given the vision recorded in Sura 66:1:
“O prophet, why forbiddest thou what God has made lawful to thee, seeking the good pleasure of thy wives…?”
Based on this aya it seems that Allah is in the business of not only getting Muhammad out of his sexual chaos, but that Allah justifies unfaithfulness and deceit as well.
We clearly see that Allah was always very quick to defend Muhammad’s desires and this is exactly what Aisha said:
I used to backbite those (females) who offered themselves for the Messenger of Allah. So I asked: Does a woman offer herself? Then the Almighty Allah revealed: you (Muhammad) may put off whom you please of them, you may take to you whom you wish, and if you desire any whom you have separated, no blame attaches to you . It seems to me that your Lord hastens to satisfy your desire.”
In other words, Allah is threatening these women that if they don’t submit to Muhammad’s desires, he will simply divorce them and get better ones. So Hafsa must not be angry that Muhammad slept with a slave girl, on her own bed , and on her turn day so Muhammad asks her to keep it secret and promises her father future postition and when she told Aisha Allah decided to threaten them.
One-day Muhammad goes to his wife’s house Hafsa the daughter of Omar and finds her maid Mariyah attractive. He sends Hafsa to Omar’s house, telling her that he wanted to see her. When Hafsa leaves, Muhammad takes Mariyah to bed and has intercourse with her. Meanwhile Hafsa, who finds out that her father was not expecting her, returns home much sooner than expected, and to her chagrin finds her illustrious husband in bed with her maid. She becomes hysteric and forgetting the station of the prophet she shouts and causes a scandal. The prophet pleads with her to calm down and promises not to sleep with Mariah anymore and begs her also not to divulge this secret to anyone else.
However, Hafsa would not control herself and relays everything to Ayisha who also turns against the prophet and jointly with his other wives cause him much anguish. So the prophet decides to punish all of them and not sleep with any one of his wives for one month. Depriving one’s wives sexually is the second grade of punishment recommended in the Quran. The first level is admonishing, the second level is depriving them of sex and the third level of punishment is beating them. Q. 4: 34.
Of course when a man decides to punish a wife with sexual deprivation he can satisfy himself with his other wives. But Muhammad’s anger had made him make the oath not to sleep with any of them for one month. That of course would have been too much of hardship for the beloved messenger of God, therefore God in his mercy came to the aid of his prophet and revealed the Surah Tahrim (Banning). In this Surah Allah rebukes Muhammad for being hard on himself and for depriving himself from what he really likes and has been made lawful for him, in order to please his wives
Now will you please give your fantasy about this
you are silly person for u r having low minded
there are many scientific fact and no contradiction and challenging word. so who could have mentioned in quran?
Come for open argument, If I can so you a single scientific error, will you leave islam ?? Whether you will accept Vedas or not, its a separate matter… But leave Islam first.
There is no single contradiction in Qur’an. Qur’an also says in surah Nisha Ch. 4. v. 82 that :- Do they not consider Qur’an with care, Had it been from anyone beside allah there would have been many contradiction. So, there is not a single contradiction but some contradistinction. I don’t think that, your contradiction is real contradiction. some contradiction can be create because of having of low memory power or lacking of High knowledge. If i say to some scientific errors in your Veda, will you leave Hinduism, Which has Science proved false?
who are you to ask us to leave ISLAM madam, will you leave vedic relegion or ur Arya samaj, if i give errors in it
@akhila
who are you to ask us to leave ISLAM madam, will you leave vedic relegion or ur Arya samaj, if i give errors in it
another brainwashed zakir fan
@samantha-
First place I am not a female. So say sir, not madam. If want to know more about me, visit http://www.akhilapadhi.weebly.com
Second thing I am not an arya samaji nor a hindu. I am a reverted christian.
Third thing is, I said to leave islam because it is against human rights. Then comment the vedas.
I support vedas because I find vedic philosophy is followed around the world.
To see how, visit my religious veiw blog of the above said web adress.
ISLAM IS GREAT
Hi ,
Can i know is there any mention in the vedas of vedic astrology , it pains me at times when i see people investing their time and money in such foolish pursuits .. most of the so called highly educated donkeys use the names of many rishi’s .
Can you explain to me something about this field as i want to clear the confusion among the people around me ….
i feel everyon e should be empowered to lead his or her own life with dignity n passion and not depend on such misleading stuff
Agniveerji,
Namaste.
I have read your most of the articles, they are logical and convenicing. I do read comments by different communities, those are disturbing. Teaching in Vedas are soothing, you are providing great services to society by preeching the knowledge. We are followers so whatever you write we understand. If your thinking could penetrate a nonfollower and bring respect for Vedas, then you are achiever through these messages. In my opinion, the more dignified way will be to just confined with Vedas, let others make comparision.
Mr.Phiroj: When can you guys smell the truth? No contradictions in Quran? Please enlighten us as to how many days it took Allah to annihilate the people of Aad?
You know what ZN is good at? Repeat an argument over and over again despite the existence of proof contrary to that. And you guys gulp everything that ZN pukes.
1. So which religion were people following before Vedas? Eg: Religion of Agniveer please shed some light.
2 .What @ animals & birds? what is their role on this earth?
3. If Vedas are so powerful then why God did not stop false religion?
4. If God is omnipresent then which direction should I pray?
1. Vedas are eternal. There was no human before vedas. So this question is baseless.
2. Read the theory of karma and rebirth. If still you have doubt open a thread in discussion forrum.
3. God has made laws and the laws are perfect and unchangeable. Every one will get a destiny according to karma. So its our knowledge and activities that can destroy the falsehood.
4. God is omnipresent means there is no space that is without god’s presence. So u dnt need any direction to pray him. Infact you dont need to pray him. Do noble deeds, he will award you whether you pray him or not. If you are not doing good, you will not be rewarded even if you pray him 100 times a day.
@hello
1. The natural path which people followed is called vedic religion or dharmic relgion, the concept of religion and dividing people based on beliefs started later.
2. Their role is same as our role , i.e to enjoy this world without causing unnecessary suffering to other life forms.
3. All religions lead to the same god, hinduism never claims exclusive rights,
All religions goal is to reach god/nirvana and in that aspect no religion is false.
4. What do you mean by pray? Is bowing down and repeating unknown verses called praying? Praying means thinking of god with love and does it require a specific direction?
@adolf
1. you didnt my qns. which religion people folowe b4 Vedas?
2. Well I am not buying that it is proven fact to gain something you got to lose something.
like you said”i.e to enjoy this world without causing unnecessary suffering to other life forms.”
please give am example on this..
3. if no religion is false then why Agniveer is starting debate and convincing people to come to Vedas by maligning other religion,
4. Well anyone can sit down corner & pray with love. There must be some system on how to pray, what is the purpose of praying without giving proper respect to God. and just pray which ever way you like it. Bowing down to God will always make you feel you are not superior, simple. Actions speaks louder than word.
@hello Namaste Brother
There are not many religion, religion only one based on Veda. Characteristic of religion – Non-violence, Truth, Non-Stealing, Brahmacharya (Self-control and NON-obscenity), Non-Hoarding, Patience, Forgiving
Purity, Contentment, Putting strong efforts, Self-study or self-evaluation, Dedication to All Supreme not agent.
@Hello (False religion)
_______if no religion is false then why Agniveer is starting debate and convincing people to come to Vedas by maligning other religion,______
No you are wrong any religion which approve keeping sex slaves, miracles, rituals & superstitions like kissing black stone, marriage between 50 years old and 6 years old child, wife beating, changing in God attitude, cruelty against animals, God cruel enough to send his children in eternal hell. Whichever religion support these immoral act is a false religion or man made religion.
@ hello
>>you didnt my qns. which religion people folowe b4 Vedas
A) Vedic religion is the natural religion and it is followed from start.
Your question is like asking when did humans started eating food. Humans are eating food from their starting, it is only after a specific time the digestion process is documented.
>> it is proven fact to gain something you got to lose something
A) you didnt notice my word unnecessary, eating fruits or plants which are annual does not cause a loss at all. Drinking milk of cows and buffaloes which produce more milk than required to its calf does not cause loss. There are innumerable things which can be gained without causing any suffering.
>> if no religion is false then why Agniveer is starting debate and convincing people to come to Vedas by maligning other religion
A) Agniveers debate is for violent muslims and proselytizers of their version of religion. Also you didnt see my words ” and in that aspect no religion is false”. What agniveer is fighting for is caste system, suppression of womens rights, dividing humans as believers and non believers, rituals like stoning of satan, bowing to a stone while labeling others as idolators, mocking people who out of their love treats god as their father…..
>>There must be some system on how to pray, what is the purpose of praying without giving proper respect to God. and just pray which ever way you like it.
A) Why are you making a policeman out of god. If bowing is proper respect then is lying flat on ground as hindus do more respect than bowing? Bowing or any other form which shows respect varies with culture and no protocol is necessary to show respect.
>> Bowing down to God will always make you feel you are not superior, simple. Actions speaks louder than word.
The idea of praying to god itself shows that we are inferior. Do you pray to inferior things like mosquitoes and…
Be cautious while reading translations of Vedas as given by western indologists. They are misleading and not based on Vedic grammar, but more on furthering their own agendas.
It is right to some extent. But the moment the theory tries to deny existence of soul, it becomes yet another hoax without any scientific basis
Yes, If he fits the eligibility criteria mentioned
This is true for anybody – doctor, engineer, clerk, housewife ………..
u get lost
u little nowing idiot…………………
saroj i.e. i myself
is saying this NOT TO AGNIVEER BUT TO THIS :
Muslim Response Debunking Agniveer !
@agniveer
Mr Yogi,
Your comment
“Vedas were provided at inception of civilization by Paramatma and not created by an human”
If you people are commenting on QURAAN in some of your previous articles that did we muslim saw with our own eyes about the revelation of QURAAN then I would like to ask you this that agniveer were you there when Vedas were revealed by your GOD,
“Archeology is a big hoax” so as per you even Archeology is hoax, science is stupid but only your religion is the true source of knowledge and other religion are wrong
“This fact of revelation of Vedas is the core foundation of our culture. The moment you try to shake it, you would foolishly put yourself in same category as Islam or Christianity”
Did anyone of you saw the original revelation of Vedas ?
“ Islam is a brutal religion. Islam is based on belief that Quran is revealed text “
.
I guess you also believe that Vedas are the revealed text the difference is we have the original of form of Quran but you don’t have the original form of vedas so sad for you
“Quran was revealed (if at all!) few hundred years ago. Even foreign so-called scholars believe Vedas to be first texts of mankind. A revealed text must be revealed at beginning of creation and not in between”
To answer you this I have one more thing the oldest book that ALLAH(S.W.T) send to us from our beloved prophet Hazrat MOOSA (Alayhis-Salaam) was TOURAAT and I guess you can calculate how many thousand years ago that cannnot be not just few years ago .
The TOURAAT (OLD TESTAMENT) was given to Hazrat MOOSA (Alayhis-Salaam).
The ZABOOR (PSALMS) were given to Hazrat DAWOOD (Alayhis-Salaam).
The INJEEL (NEW TESTAMENT) was given to Hazrat ESA (Alayhis-Salaam).
HOLY QURAN, the final Book of Allah was revealed to Hazrat MUHAMMAD MUSTAFA .
“ Vedas can not be altered at all “There is no original form of Vedas what are you saying about altering it
, so sad for you Mr agniveer ji
however the original form…
Where is the original scripture of vedas
however the original form of Quran exists
The Arabic Quran, Mus-haf Al-Medina Al-Nabaweeh, King Fahd edition, Issued according to the Royal decree number 1540/8 on 19/8/1403, and printed in 1409 AH
“one cannot be eligible to comment on Vedas unless he or she is a yogi.”
So according to me as you are not a Muslim you are no one to comment on Quraan
@ samantha : u r no Islam scholar. if at all you have the guts, reply back here in this thread.
“If you people are commenting on QURAAN in some of your previous articles that did we muslim saw with our own eyes about the revelation of QURAAN then I would like to ask you this that agniveer were you there when Vedas were revealed by your GOD,”
what do u mean u saw with ur eyes the revelation of quran? were u there 1400 years ago? if u r meaning the arabs in the time of Muhammad : they “saw” the revelation? really? Apart from Muhammad having fits of epiliepsy and shouting of Gods word, u have just Muhammad’s own guarantee that he spoke the truth. And I would rather not believe a guy who said Allah gave him permission when he wanted to screw a 6 year old. Or you mean to say arabs saw Muhammad soaring into the sky on a flying donkey?
“Vedas can not be altered at all “There is no original form of Vedas what are you saying about altering it , so sad for you Mr agniveer ji
Where is the original scripture of vedas however the original form…”
Vedas were transmitted orally. Some errors may have cropped up when they made texts of it, but the unadulterated version is still in existence. Refer textual corruption of vedas article here on this site.
@Samantha
Samantha, whats your pick on sex slaves in Quran and female slavery??? Polygamy??? Quran is full of such immoral practices, as a woman, do you feel happy with this?
“one cannot be eligible to comment on Vedas unless he or she is a yogi.”
So according to me as you are not a Muslim you are no one to comment on Quraan”
> Did he say that you are not eligible to comment because you are not a brahmin? all he meant was that the approach shoould be right in learning vedas : being a yogi, one who is in the path to understand God in a truthful manner : are you such one? if not, please refrain from commenting anymore. if yes,continue.
Samantha, I like your toddler stories but the audience on this site are not the ones that nod like cattle to Zakir Naik’s claptrap.
Do you know how many different Qurans exist in addition to the Shia and Sunni versions of the same book?? There are many manuscripts of Quran in the great mosque at Sanaa, Yemen. In 1972, during the restoration of this Great Mosque, laborers working in a crown space between the structure’s inner and outer roofs, stumbled across a amazing grave site containing an unappealing mountain of old parchment and paper documents, damaged books and individual pages of Arabic text, fused together by rain and dampness for over a thousand year.
By realizing the potential importance of the find, the President of ‘Yemeni Antiquities Authority’ sought international assistance in examining and preserving the fragments, because no scholar in his country was capable of working on this rich find. In 1979, he managed to interest a visiting non-Muslim German scholar, who in turn persuaded the German government to organize and fund a restoration project.
Soon after the project began, it became clear that the “paper grave” was a resting place for, among other things, tens of thousands of fragments from close to a thousand different codices of the Qur’an. Muslim authorities during early days cherished the belief that worn out and damaged copies of the Quran must be removed from circulation leaving only the unblemished editions of the scripture for use. Also such a safe place was required to protect the books from looting or destruction if invaders come and hence the idea of a grave in the Great Mosque in Sana’a, which was a place of learning and dissemination of the Quran and was in existence from the first century of the Hijrah.
Restoration of the manuscript has been organized and supervised by Gerd R. Puin and H. C. Graf V. Bothmer. Carbon-14 tests date some of the parchments to 645-690 AD. Calligraphic dating has pointed to 710-715 AD. Some of the parchment pages seemed to date back to the…
So much for the original form, it has to be collected from bones and rocks, who knew what muhammad uttered , who knew what aisha heard..
>>So according to me as you are not a Muslim you are no one to comment on Quraan
Muslims claim every one is a born muslim so every one has the right to comment on quran!!
To Samantha – cntd.,
seventh and eighth centuries, or Islam’s first two centuries, perhaps the oldest Quran in existence. Between 1983 and 1996, approximately 15,000 out of 40,000 pages were restored, specifically 12,000 fragments on parchment and manuscripts dating back to the seventh and eighth centuries.
The rare style of fine and artistic handwriting had fascinated both Puin and Bothmer but more surprise was waiting for them. When these ancient Qurans were compared with the present standard one, both of them were stunned. The ancient texts were found to be devastatingly and disturbingly at odds with the existing form. There are unconventional verse ordering, significant textual variations, different orthography (spelling) and different artistic embellishment (decoration).
As if it is not enough, many manuscripts showed the sign of palimpsests, i.e., versions very clearly written over even earlier washed off versions. The under-writing of palimpsest is, of course, often difficult to read visually, but modern tools such as ultraviolet photography can highlight them. It suggests that the Sana’a manuscripts are not the only variants, but, even before that, Quranic text had been modified and re-written on the same paper. It means, Allah’s claim (Q: 56. 77-78; 85. 21-22) that original text is preserved in heaven on golden tablets, which none can touch except angels is also a fairy-tale.
Samantha, this is just for starters. Inscriptions of several Qur’anic verses are
decorated on the Dome of Rock of Jerusalem, which is most probably the first Islamic monument meant to be a major artistic achievement, built in 691 CE. These
inscriptions significantly differ from the present standard text
Ofcourse I have not even touched the topic of multiple Qurans that were burnt by your caliphs….So stop claiming that Quran is uncorrupted.
You all are bloody ass holes, do u mean that we come and accept ur thought of ur stupid agniveer, there is no point in xplaining u people, to give the better answers there is one good xample, there are over 120 crores muslims in this whole worls and we are proud to be a muslim and as ur so said 50K Arya samaji
, tell ur agniveer to go and help him get treated to a mental hospital with all u people 
, was arya samaj so small to be able to convince these many people , i m sro sry for u , ur agniveer and ur stupid relegion 
@Ashwin,
Like it is unadultrated form of vedas exist for you, and how can we accept that it was not altered in so many years and if it was transmitted orally, who wrote it ?
do u have the name of the person who wrote it, so how can we beleive ur vedas is the original scripture
please let me know where is the UNADULTRATED ORIGINAL FORM OF VEDAS, i guess u and ur ass hole agniveer are seeing them in dreams
please reply
@ashwin
, be a yogi and then comment on vedas amd be a msulim then comment on Quraan 
.
You bloddy stupid ass hole i am a reverted muslim and came in ISLAM 3 years back, so i knw abt ISLAM more than u
Didi ur agniveer saw ur GOD , and my dear ashwin i am commenting on his ur so called Mr agniveer bastard that ” u should be yogi to comment on Vedas ” so are you all yogis
Dear Mr adolf ,
I am a muslim and you can check my previous blogs for that and your Stupid Agniveer considers Aracheolgists also as nuts as per his previous blogs, so why are you collecting it from old rocks and bones those will be requiring the help and Archaelogist, may be ur agniverr will dig the gole and buid up a rock and will say , yipee i saw a scripture of veda over it
@ samantha : please go through the numerous articles on vedas in this site and then comment. here is a sampler: http://agniveer.com/3937/who-wrote-vedas/
here is a sampler : http://agniveer.com/3937/who-wrote-vedas/
there are many articles on vedas here in this site. Go through them, and if not convinced then comment here.
” You all are bloody ass holes, do u mean that we come and accept ur thought of ur stupid agniveer, there is no point in xplaining u people, to give the better answers there is one good xample, there are over 120 crores muslims in this whole worls and we are proud to be a muslim and as ur so said 50K Arya samaji , tell ur agniveer to go and help him get treated to a mental hospital with all u people , was arya samaj so small to be able to convince these many people , i m sro sry for u , ur agniveer and ur stupid relegion ”
see? This is the problem if you are not a yogi and start commenting on Vedas.
Vedas wont make sense to you and you wont make sense to anybody else too. 
“i am a reverted muslim and came in ISLAM 3 years back, so i knw abt ISLAM more than u”
If yes, then I seem to be knowing more about Islam than you. If not, then I take it that Quran encourages its followers to abuse other people and their faiths: which is your take?
Really? Am I correct in saying that in Islam it is forbidden to abuse another’s faith ? That you should only argue with them in the best of ways and not use abusive language?
> and you conveniently hopped around Mr. Rushmore’s observations on corruption of Quran: is it that you know the actual truth
or afraid now : that your “reversion” to truth wasnt truth after all?
@samantha francis
>> so why are you collecting it from old rocks and bones those will be requiring the help and Archaelogist, may be ur agniverr will dig the gole and buid up a rock and will say , yipee i saw a scripture of veda over it.
A.) Quran is collected from rocks and bones. Please read what is written carefully. Please read your history before questioning about other religions. I never told you that vedas are collected from rocks and bones.
__Q: Swamiji, my pranams to you. I read an article that the Vedas are corrupted and hence not authentic. Please clarify me. Thank you. __
http://vedmandir.com/node/1294
Ans…….My blessings to you. In this regard, I paste my article. In case of further doubt, you can always put forth your query.
Could Vedas too have been corrupted by wrong insertions?
Actually Manusmriti, Ramayana, Geeta and Bhagwad geeta etc, were not condemned by the arrogant they tried to add false shlokas to change the real meaning only. Whereas directly or indirectly, the arrogant tried to spread a fear regarding Vedas that Vedas are difficult/hard and must not be studied. So they did not touch the Vedas.
Secondly, when the propaganda was being made against the Vedas, many learned of Vedas were alive and could oppose but the learned were not much interested to study other holy books except Vedas, as Vedas are complete knowledge.
Thirdly, the language of the Vedas was typical for them being divine Sanskrit language and not man-made. So less than a complete Yogi is not able to make any change in Vedic eternal mantras because first mantras will have to be learnt for which Sanskrit knowledge was to be gained which was a typical job for arrogant. You see, even at present no false prophet or arrogant has tried to change the idea of Ved mantras, yet they are creating fear that Vedas are not needed to be studied. However, Maxmuller and other persons still tried to change the real meaning of Ved mantras but those people did not dare to add any Ved mantra etc.
You will see that at one place, a truth is seen in the above Manusmriti shlokas etc., and thereafter the false shlokas added therein, contradict the truth but as far as Vedas are concerned, still the truth begins right from the beginning till end. There is no contradiction. So no false mantras are added in eternal knowledge of Vedas which emanates direct from God. In India, there are so many learned Brahmins who have the knowledge of all Ved mantras by heart and any change if…
Cont……….
http://agniveer.com/1948/vedas-myths-misconceptions/#comment-80078
In India, there are so many learned Brahmins who have the knowledge of all Ved mantras by heart and any change if made, which is even impossible, being divine Sanskrit language, they will come forward against it.
Vedas, are still originated in the heart of a Yogi as I have already stated giving the proof of Kapil muni’s Sankhya sutras 5/48 to 51 and Atharvaveda mantra 4/30/3 wherein it is clearly stated that the mantras are now also originated in the heart of a Ashtang yogi but on the contrary, Manusmriti or any other granth written by Rishi is never originated in the heart of a yogi or anybody else. So in the said holy granths comparison of false or true shlokas is mostly not possible.
As you know, at the time of final destruction of universe, all the granths including the true granths will be no more and the printed copies of the Vedas will also be destroyed. But as per the rules of the God vide Yajurveda 31/7 and Shwetashwataropnishad 6/8 eternal knowledge of the Vedas will automatically be originated in the heart of four rishis.