- Brahmin, Shudra….I don’t care
- The reality of caste system – Next Move
- The reality of caste system – 2
- The reality of caste system – 1
- Is Purush Sukta of Vedas casteist?
- There is no caste-system in Vedas
- Vedas and Dignity of Labor
- Rakshas in Vedas and Hinduism
- Vedas and Daas
- Vedas and Dasyu in Hinduism
- Vedas and Shudra
It is unfortunate that in our country, where Vedas were the foundation of our culture, we forgot these original lessons of Vedas and got trap in a variety of misconceptions regarding birth-based caste system and discrimination of people born in certain caste collectively known as Shudras.
The misleading theories of communists and biased Indologists have already caused great damage to our society and have sown seeds of differences. It is unfortunate that so-called Dalits consider themselves outcast, and hence, we fail to unite for prosperity and security. The only solution is to go back to the roots – the Vedas – and rebuild our understanding of our relationships with each other.
In this chapter, we will further evaluate the reality of caste system and see many examples of Varna Migration.
What is caste?
The concept of caste is relatively new. Vedas contain no word that can be considered a synonym for ‘caste.’ The two words commonly considered to mean ‘caste,’ are Jaati and Varna. However, the truth is that all the three mean completely different things.
Caste is a European innovation having no semblance in Vedic culture.
What is Jaati?
Jaati means a classification based on the source of origin. Nyaya Sutra states “Samaanaprasavaatmika Jaatih” or those having similar birth source form a Jaati.
An initial broad classification made by Rishis is four-fold:
• Udbhija (coming out of ground like plants)
• Andaja (coming out of eggs like birds and reptiles)
• Pindaja (mammals) and
• Ushmaj (reproducing due to temperatures and ambient conditions like virus and bacteria.)
Similarly, various animals like elephant, lion, rabbits, etc. form different ‘Jaati.’ In the same manner, entire humanity forms one ‘Jaati’. A particular Jaati will have similar physical characteristics, cannot change from one Jaati to another, and cannot crossbreed. Jaati is the creation of Ishwar or God.
Brahmin, Kshatriya, Vaishya, and Shudra are no way different Jaati because there is no difference in the source of birth or even physical characteristics to differentiate between them.
Later, word ‘Jaati’ started being used to imply any classification. In common usage, we call even different communities as different ‘Jaati.’ However, that is merely convenience of usage. In reality, all humans form one single Jaati.
What is Varna?
The actual word used for Brahmin, Kshatriya, Vaishya and Shudra is ‘Varna’ and not Jaati.
The word ‘Varna’ is used not only for these four but also for Dasyu and Arya.
‘Varna’ means one that is adopted by choice. While Jaati is provided by God, ‘Varna’ is our own choice.
Those who choose to be Arya are called ‘Arya Varna.’ Those who choose to be Dasyu become ‘Dasyu Varna’. Same for Brahmin, Kshatriya, Vaishya, and Shudra.
That is why Vedic Dharma is called ‘Varnashram Dharma.’ The word Varna itself implies that this is based on complete freedom of choice and meritocracy.
Those involved in intellectual activities have chosen ‘Brahmin Varna’. Those into defense and warfare are ‘Kshatriya Varna’. Those in economics and animal rearing are ‘Vaishya Varna’ and those involved in other support functions are “Shudra Varna”. They refer merely to various choices of professions and have nothing to do with any Jaati or birth.
“Purush Sukta”- The biggest culprit?
Often mantras of Purush Sukta are cited to prove that Brahmins originated from Mouth, Kshatriya from hands, Vaishya from thighs and Shudras from legs of God. Hence, these Varnas are birth-based. However, nothing could be more deceptive. Let us see why:
Vedas describe God to be shapeless and unchangeable. How can such a God take the shape of a gigantic person if He is shapeless?
If indeed this were true, this would defy the theory of Karma of Vedas because as per Theory of Karma, one’s family of birth can change as per his or her deeds. One born in Shudra family can take birth as king’s son in next birth. But if Shudras are born from feet of God, how can same Shudra again take birth from hands of God?
The soul is timeless and never born. The soul can have no Varna. It is only when the soul takes birth as a human it has a chance to opt a Varna. Then what does it mean by a Varna coming from one part of God’s body? If Soul did not take birth from God’s body, then does it mean the body of the soul is prepared from God’s body parts? However, as per Vedas, even nature is eternal. And same atoms recycle among various humans. It is technically impossible for anyone taking birth from God’s body, even if we assume God to be having a body.
“Purush Sukta” – The actual meaning
The said Purush Sukta is in 31st Chapter of Yajurveda, apart from Rigveda and Atharvaveda with some variations. In Yajurveda, it is 31.11. To see what it actually means, let us look at the previous mantra 31.10. It asks a question – Who is mouth? Who is hand? Who is thigh and who is leg?
The next mantra gives the answer – Brahmin is the mouth. Kshatriya is hand. Vaishya is thigh and Shudra becomes the legs.
Note that the mantra does not say that Brahmin “takes birth” from mouth…It says Brahmin “is” mouth. Because if the mantra would mean “takes birth” it would not answer the question in previous mantra “Who is mouth?”
For example, if I ask “Who is Dashrath?” An answer like “Rama is born from Dashrath” would be meaningless!
The actual meaning is: In society, Brahmins or intellectuals form the brain, head or mouth that think and speak. Kshatriyas or defense personnel form the hands that protect. Vaishyas or producers and businessmen form the thigh that support and nurture (note that thigh bone or femur produces blood and is the strongest bone). In Atharvaveda, instead of Uru or Thigh, the word “Madhya” is used meaning that it also denotes the stomach and central part of the body. Shudra or Labor force forms the legs that lay the foundation and make the body run.
The next mantras talk of other parts of this body like mind, eyes, etc. The Purush Sukta describes the origin and continuation of creation including human society and states ingredients of a meaningful society.
It is a pity that such a beautiful allegorical description of society and creation is distorted to mean something that is completely contrary to Vedic ethos.
Even the Brahman texts, Manusmriti, Mahabharat, Ramayan, and Bhagvat, do not state anything even close to the crazy hypothesis of God creating Brahmins by tearing of flesh from his mouth, Kshatriya from the flesh of hands and so on.
It is thus obvious why Brahmins are accorded high respect in Vedas. This is same as what happens even in modern society. Scholars and experts get our respect because they form the direction-providers for entire humanity. However, as we have discussed in previous chapters, the dignity of labor is equally emphasized in Vedas, and hence, there is no element of discrimination.
In Vedic culture, everyone is considered to be born as Shudra. Then based on his or her education, one becomes a Brahmin, Kshatriya or Vaishya. This completion of education is considered to be the second birth. Hence, these three Varnas are called “Dwija” or twice-born. But those who remain uneducated for whatever reasons are not discarded from society. They continue as Shudra and perform support activities for the society.
A son of Brahmin, if he fails to complete his education, becomes a Shudra. Similarly, son of a Shudra or even a Dasyu, if he completes his education can become a Brahmin, Kshatriya or Vaishya. This is a pure meritocracy. The way degrees are accorded today; Yajnopaveet was provided in the Vedic system. Further, non-compliance with the code of conduct for each Varna could result in taking away of the Yajnopaveet.
Examples of change of Varnas
There are many examples exist of change of Varnas in Vedic history.
• Aitareya Rishi was the son of a Daasa or criminal but became a Brahmin of the highest order and wrote Aitareya Brahman and Aitareyopanishad. Aitareya Brahman is considered critical to understanding Rigveda.
• Ailush Rishi was the son of a Daasi, gambler and of low character. However, he researched on Rigveda and made several discoveries. Not only he was invited by Rishis but also made an Acharya. (Aitareya Brahman 2.19)
• Satyakaam Jaabaal was the son of a prostitute but became a Brahmin.
• Prishadh was the son of King Daksha but became a Shudra. Further, he did Tapasya to achieve salvation after repenting.
• (Vishnu Puran 4.1.14) Had Tapasya been banned for Shudra as per the fake story from Uttar Ramayan, how could Prishadh do so?
• Nabhag, son of King Nedishtha, became Vaishya. Many of his sons again became Kshatriya. (Vishnu Puran 4.1.13)
• Dhrist was son of Nabhag (Vaishya) but became Brahmin, and his son became Kshatriya (VP 4.2.2)
• Further in his generation, some became Brahmin again (VP 9.2.23)
• As per Bhagvat, Agniveshya became Brahmin though born to a king.
• Rathotar born in Kshatriya family became a Brahmin as per Vishnu Puran and Bhagvat.
• Haarit became Brahmin though born to Kshatriya (Vishnu Puran 4.3.5)
• Shaunak became Brahmin though born in Kshatriya family. (Vishnu Puran 4.8.1). In fact, as per Vayu Puran, Vishnu Puran, and Harivansh Puran, sons of Shaunak Rishi belonged to all four Varnas.
• Similar examples exist of Gritsamad, Veethavya, and Vritsamati.
• Matanga was the son of Chandal but became a Brahmin.
• Raavan was born from Pulatsya Rishi but became a Rakshas.
• Pravriddha was the son of Raghu King but became a Rakshas.
• Trishanku was a king but became a Chandal.
• Sons of Vishwamitra became Shudra. Vishwamitra himself was a Kshatriya, who later became a Brahmin.
• Vidur was the son of a servant but became a Brahmin and minister of Hastinapur Empire.
The word “Shudra” has come in Vedas around 20 times. Nowhere has it been used in a derogatory manner. Nowhere has it mentioned that Shudras are untouchable, birth-based, disallowed from study of Vedas, lesser in status than other Varnas, disallowed in Yajnas.
In Vedas, Shudra means a hard-working person. (Tapase Shudram – Yajurveda 30.5). That is why Purush Sukta calls them as the foundation of entire human society.
Since the four Varnas refer to four kinds of activities by choice, as per Vedas, the same person exhibits characteristics of the four Varnas in different situations. Everyone belongs to all the four Varnas. However, for simplicity sake, we refer to the predominant profession to be the representative Varna.
Hence, all humans should strive to be all the four Varnas to best of their capabilities, as per Vedic wisdom. This is the essence of Purush Sukta.
The Rishis like Vasisth, Vishwamitra, Angira, Gautam, Vasudeva and Kanva exhibited traits of all the four Varnas. They discovered meanings of Vedic mantras, destroyed Dasyus, did manual labor and indulged in wealth management for social welfare.
We should also emulate the same.
Summary
In summary, we see that the Vedic society considers all humans to be one single Jaati or race, upholds the dignity of labor and provides equal opportunity for all humans to adopt the Varna of their choice.
There is no element of birth-based discrimination of any manner in the Vedas.
May we all unite together as one integrated family, reject the last element of birth-based discrimination of any manner and embrace each other as brothers and sisters.
May we also thwart the designs of those who want to mislead us by making baseless claims of casteism in Vedas and destroy the criminals aka Dasyu/Daas/Rakshas.
May we all come under the shelter of Vedas and work together to strengthen the humanity as one single family.
This article is also available in Hindi at http://agniveer.com/4034/caste-vedas-hi/
The Constitution mandated that a portion of government jobs and seats in legislatures be reserved for adivasis. As with the untouchables, this was a matter of compensatory justice: a case of Hindus making up in the present for the crimes they had committed in the past.
– Jaipal Singh Munda: January, 1903 – March, 1970. A distinguished parliamentarian, a sportsman of international repute, an educationist, a politician with great vision and courage, a powerful orator with mastery over multiple national and foreign languages, a multi-faceted personality.
I would like to quote “the real Abhishek” here:
————-
‘Vedas’ is mostly
1. singing hymns in praise of “God”
2. Justification of rituals and yagnas in pleasing weather-gods and other demi-god deities.
3. Singing praise of “chants”
4. Singing praise of fire and sacrifice.
(Note that Brahma-Vishnu-Mahesh were born much afterwards. They were given “birth” by Zoroaster. The Vedic Aryans plagiarized Zoroaster’s Trinity. There are linguistic and archaeological evidences to support my claim. The other interesting Gods like Lakshmi and Ganesh were “born” much later – somewhere during the composition of Puranas)
I will just take a comic detour – The word “daeva” is an Iranian word for “liar”. In the Iranian language “Ahura Mazda” is (approximately) “highest wisdom”. The Iranians called themselves “ahuric” and called the Vedic Aryans “daevas”. The Vedic Aryans called their God-kings daevas [“Gods”] and the Iranian God-kings as “asuras” (derived from ahura.) [“demons”]
So, there is some divine comedy even in deepest tragedies.
——————
P.S. this comment is an excerpt of “The real Abhishek” ‘s comments on the passionForCinema blog post titled “in-defence-of-the-i” authored by Anurag Kashyap. I found Abhishek’s comments on Ayn Rand and hinduism interesting
@rabrav,
The author can have his opinion. As vedas speak on many things people can see what they want to see in vedas. Advaitans see vedas as pointing to the atman, where as dvaita people see mention of gods in vedas. The idea of vishnu and shiva are not a later addition to vedas, shiva as rudra and vishnu as hiranyagarbha are present from the start of vedas(if we interpret cronologically).
It is true that in time the caste system has become perverted, as Sri Aurobindo also noted : “it is the nature of human institutions to degenerate; there is no doubt that the institution of caste degenerated. It ceased to be determined by spiritual qualifications which, once essential, have now come to be subordinate and even immaterial and is determined by the purely material tests of occupation and birth… By this change it has set itself against the fundamental tendency of Hinduism which is to insist on the spiritual and subordinate the material and thus lost most of its meaning. the spirit of caste arrogance, exclusiveness and superiority came to dominate it instead of the spirit of duty, and the change weakened the nation and helped to reduce us to our present condition…(India’s Rebirth, p 27) Today, the abuses being done in the name of caste are often horrifying, specially to a Westerner brought up on more egalitarian values. Some of the backward villages of Tamil Nadu, or Bihar for instance, still segregate Harijans and the lower castes, who do not have the same access to educational facilities than the upper castes, in spite of Nehru’s heavy-handed quota system, which has been badly taken advantage off.
Francois Gautier, born in Paris in 1950, is a French journalist and writer
Dalit boycott by Muslims leaves Gujarat’s Sanand village edgy
http://www.dnaindia.com/india/report_dalit-boycott-by-muslims-leaves-gujarat-s-sanand-village-edgy_1565010
For 500 odd dalits in Andej village which has a population of over 5,000, buying 1 kg rice is a 30 km return journey.This is despite the fact that there are a dozen odd shops in the village laden with all the goods they need. The tragedy is that they are refused even a rickshaw ride, though they have money to afford one!
The social boycott of the dalit families here by the dominant Muslim community, has made life miserable for them.
The Muslim boycott of the backward communities started on July 1 after a scuffle between two groups in which a dalit was left with a fracture in the left hand. The injured man lodged a police complaint under the Prevention of Atrocities Act against those who had assaulted him.
This upset the majority population of the village. It was soon followed bya verbal fatwa warning the auto-drivers of the community that they would be fined Rs2,000 if they ferried a dalit community passenger.
The gorcery shops followed suit. Andej has some 700 Muslim and 100 dalit families, includingShenwa, Valmiki and Rohit communities. There are around 40 Patel families in the village too.
Since July 1, 2011, the 100 backward communities including Dalits have been boycotted by the Muslims of the village and are allegedly not allowed to purchase anything from the public market. They are also not allowed to use the local transport system which is dominated by Muslim auto-drivers from the village.
The 100 families are forced to use other means of transport which are much most costly. The village has around 15 Shenwa and 60 Rohit community families. Both these communities are considered backward even among the Dalit communities.
“We are not allowed to purchase anything from the local market,” Shankar Shenwa told DNA. “They (Muslims) have announced a penalty of Rs2000 on any Muslim driver who allows us to sit in his…
As usual HINDU baitors/muslim appeasers media is not interested in covering this.
Brother Shravak
Your post exposes the truth behind Islamic equality for humans.
Your comment remained incomplete may be due to exceeding the word limit. Please post the remaining portion too.
Thanks for the enlightening post..
ah apologise brother Vajra, here is the continuation…
vehicle,” Shankar added. The scuffle that led to the atrocity case and the boycott took place after Shankar’s brother, Manu Shenwa, was accused of stealing stones meant for some construction work in the village being carried out by one Hussain Khokhar.”Khokhar came to my house, asked me about the stones, and then started beating me. Later other people joined him,” Manu told DNA. He said that Khokhar, along with five other people, had assaulted him and fractured his left hand.
An atrocity case was eventually filed by Manu. This precipitated a boycott of all the backward communities of the village by the majority Muslim community.Fatu Rehmu, sarpanch of Andej Gram Panchayat, was not available for his comment but, her husband, who handles all the activities of the panchayat, told DNA that it was true that the Muslim auto-drivers were boycotting the backward communities.
“But they are doing this because they do not want any conflict between the two communities. It is best to avoid people from these communities if there is a possibility of conflict,” he said. However, he denied that members of the backward community were being prevented from purchasing anything from the local market.Suresh Jadhav, a local Dalit activist, told DNA that when they tried to intervene and sort out the matter, Muslim families said that they would do so only on the condition that the atrocity case was withdrawn.
Hi Agniveer,
By birth I am a Muslim and belongs to very conservative Shia Muslim family, but not following Islam from last 6 years, left meat and celebrating eid and other festivals. My father told me that we converted in 17th century. I am interested to go back to my original religion, I read satyarth prakash and it enlightened me, but the only question is abt my future, In what cast I will be moved, what abt my marriage etc. Please suggest.
Sameer
Namaste Brother,
The fact that you have decided to come back to your natural original religion in sufficient to bring the conversion. So the conversion has already happened. However to mark it symbolically so that it pegs you to the resolve of having Vedic standards in life, we can have a simple ceremony. As for your future – your caste will remain the same – human being. As per Vedas, all human beings are one caste. If you are talking about Brahmin, Shudra etc, that purely depends on your directions in life. If you are illiterate, you would be a Shudra. But assuming that you are educated (or else you would not have written this comment or read Satyarth Prakash!), you would be Brahmin if you are in education sector, Kshatriya if in defense sector and Vaishya if commercial sector. You don’t need any certificate to have you approved in any Varna. It is just a nomenclature.
As for marriage, as a male human being, you are allowed to marry any female human being of your choice who is not a close relative. You can marry a girl of any religion, region or community but it is recommended that you both are compatible, have similar hygeine and food habits, and have common directions for future. No one can act as a judge to dictate whom you can marry and whom you cannot. You can continue with your old name or have a new name whatever suits you best. If you decide for a new name and a simple ceremony as event for your change in life, we can assist you and sponsor the same. So while the conversion has already happened for you through knowledge, there is a lot you can do to celebrate this conversion through worthwhile actions. We would be glad to assist you with further details on anything that you would like to know further on this.
Dhanyavad
Admin
Great response!
Hinduism is completely unrelated to man-made caste divisions based on birth.
@Sameer:
Welcome to Hinduism. You neednt worry about which caste you want to convert into. You neednt take my words for it. Here’s what Ashtavakra told Janaka:
“Na Tvam Vipradiko Varno Nashrami…
You do NOT belong to any caste or to any asrama.”
You are beyond all that. Good luck!
true no caste system only corrupted system… haha…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8MgLYuU9AQg
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CASTE Vs VARNA Vs JATI
The original meaning of Jati was different in Ancient Bharatvarsha, than what it is today.
In Bharatvarsha, there were many Jatis like Deva-jati, Manava-jati, Rakshasa-jati, Vanara-jati. There were some foreign Jatis like Javanas, Asuras.
The Bharatiya Sanskriti originated in Devabhumi Himalayas, and ancient language was Deva-bhasa Sanskrita, and script is Deva-nagari. From one Jati, other different Jatis has originated from long time as population increased.
(The Aryan Race Theory was invented by the British for their own gain which is proved wrong after people found that the North & South Indians originated from the same Gene. No where in the vedas and other ancient Indian text the terms Aryan used to refer to a race or classification. Aryan in Sanskrit means Nobleman.)
Jati is broader term it refers to any broader classification like: Manava-Jati, Deva-Jati, Rakshasa-jati, Vanara-jati., Nara-Jati, Pashu-Jati etc. But this Jati is based on birth in particular beings & origin. but this is not related to Caste. All Indians belong to same Bharatiya Sanskriti.
Varana is the Real caste based on Accupation(work) and Aptitude/Gunas. Varna is the social order based on Accupation(work) and Aptitude/Gunas.
(What do you think of this possibility: A person is ksatriyas(Warrior or administrative class)according to Varna and according to Jati the same person is Vaisya(mercantile) or sudra(Labour) or Brahmana is this possible?. No, right!. )
People with different occupation to do different services (or job) is required in the Society, without this society cannot run so 4 social classifications(Varna) are made according to one’s Aptitude/skills & Work but not based on Birth. Every Person & every Caste have to be given Respect. Everyone is the Individual Soul & everyone is Spiritual and everyone is doing their service to the society.
Is Caste just a Social classification on Work & Aptitude?
Scriptures says Every Person have to be given Respect. Everyone is the Individual Soul & everyone is Spiritual.
But what is Caste/Varna/Jati?
People with different occupation to do different services (or job) is required in the Society, without this society cannot run so 4 classifications are made according to one’s Aptitude/skills & Work but not based on Birth. By doing job/Serving according to ones Aptitude/Skills/Guna one has to reach to higher levels by purification. But this varna is not to divide people.
Bhagavad Gita Slokas 4.13, 18.41 to 47 its is given clearly that Varana(Caste) is based on Occupation and Quality. But people who are claiming their caste based on Birth, this is misinterpretation & wrong.
(Anyway in the normal world also it’s followed indirectly as classifications like Labours, workers, TL, manager, CEO, President based on their own qualification/Aptitude & work but not based on Birth. Anyway CEO / President is known as higher then Labours /workers)
Vedas, Bhagavad Gita mentions Chapter 4 sloka 13: (4.13): Caste is based on Occupation(work) and Aptitude/Gunas, but not based on Birth.
One’s caste is based on his Occupation & Aptitude(Qualities) but not based on his Fathers or Grandfathers occupation or Aptitude. If a Person is working as worker, Businessman, engineer, Labor or Farmer he cannot claim himself as Warriors, Leaders, Kings or Ksatriya’s, Even though his grandfathers were Warriors, Leaders, or Ksatriya’s because his caste is based on his Occupation and his Aptitude, Guna. Ones caste will be same as his ancestors only if he is doing the same work and he has same Gunas as his ancestors.
Jati is broader term it refers to any broader classification like: Manava-Jati, Deva-Jati, Rakshasa-jati, Vanara-jati., Nara-Jati, Pashu-Jati etc. But this Jati is based on birth in particular beings & origin. but this is not related to Caste. All Indians belong to same Bharatiya Sanskriti.
Every Person &…
@Agniveer….
I completely agree with you on explanation of Jaati, this is perfect right. And also I agree that Varna is the real caste(social division), with reference to Bhagavad Gita as follows :
Bhagavad Gita mentions Chapter 4 sloka 13: (4.13): Caste is based on Occupation(work) and Aptitude/Gunas, but not based on Birth.
Bhagavad -Gita 4.13: “According to the three modes of material nature and the work ascribed to them, the four divisions of human society were created.”
These divisions are brahmanas(Priest), ksatriyas(Warrior or administrative class), vaisyas(mercantile class), sudras(laborer class).
“Truth alone triumphs”
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according to you we can divide the people based on their profession and not by rheir birth
Cast is not the dividing up of society based on profession, but the make up the unified society where anyone can move or even be part of multiple professions. All the Vedas are doing is describing the make up of any society for it to function. These are just components of any society. I never read anywhere in the Vedas that talk about discrimination based on your profession or anything. Nor did I read anywhere that someone is born into a profession. It is totally equal. And if you believe otherwise, please quote from the Vedas a reputable translation supported by people who actually practice what the Vedas say.
And also there is no word called caste in the Vedas. I read the Vedas and no where can I find the word caste anywhere in it. It is a foreign word to the Vedas. Be Educated.
Varnas is not the dividing up of society by profession, but describing the different components of society that unite society.
And from my understanding of the Vedas, people are not support refer to themselves as Brahmins or Sudhras or anything. When I read the Vedas I never read the Vedas say to refer to yourself as Brahmin or Sudhra. I just view the four systems as a way to understand the society’s structure. That is all the system is. Just a way to understand the structure of a society, and people have corrupted it to mean something else. We need to stop this non-sense and view every Dharmic person as a brother and sister.
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HIIIII Agniveer gi
I am fully agree with you.
Come on, This whole article is a pathetic attempt to elevate religious documents. Who gives a shit what the vedas said? They were written by ignorant people over 3000 years ago and should not be a basis for any sort of morality. The fact is it is easy to see that discrimination and hatred on the basis of birth is wrong, and it is IRRELEVANT whether the vedas support or condone that. Its like saying Aristotle never said innocent kids should be tortured, HENCE innocent kids should not be tortured, and hence everything else Aristotle said must be true even though we now know he was wrong about a lot of things.
Somya Dhawan,
little knowledge is dangerous thing,It is assumed (by most of the Indians too like yourself who do not have a cultural identity except a name/passport) (proliferated by the indologists ) that the birth based discrimination is an entity derived from the vedas , the same has been rebutted here.
No, i do not believe “that the birth based discrimination is an entity derived from the vedas”….I have a functioning brain……..but my point, which you so graciously missed, was that debunking this myth does not give any more credibility to a 3000 year old text as a basis for lifestyle.
Who decides what should be the basis of one’s lifestyle? Which text/texts according to you should be basis/bases for one’s lifestyle?
I dont need any texts to be the basis of my life-style you pea-brain. I use LOGIC and REASONING.
I dont need a book to tell me its wrong to discriminate.
and yes i am an atheist
Discrimination is not an evil quality by itself. It is what is being discriminated against is what can be classified as being right or wrong: to elucidate this point further, everyone should be able to discriminate between what is corrupt and what is not. Now, this quality is not acquired overnight just like that. You have to acquaint yourself with ideas, opinions, beliefs, etc. of different shades and hues to be able to hone this quality. And of course, reading of texts is one of the most potent ways of striking up that acquaintanceship. BTW, it is far better being a pea-brain than being a brainless retard.
@Somya : before you revert, a good read for you would be “Breaking India” by Rajiv Malhotra
Just would like to know if you are an atheist or one of those “secular” hypocrites who go on with their vitriolic anti-hindu rant for reasons best known to them.
How were these “ignorant people” able to write treatises in Sanskrit?
Well, you seem to be in the habit of looking at the glass half empty. Aristotle maybe was wrong about a lot of things, but he sure was right about at least a few things if I am not mistaken.
and i am not using ignorant as a pejorative term…..they weren’t ignorant about language but they certainly were ignorant about science, philosophy, medicine as was everybody else in that time.
Now, this is the height of ignorance. You have a plenty of catching up to do. Do you even the understand the meaning of the term “ignorant”? Probably, you don’t. It is your deep-seated animosity that is on full display. Anyways, you can live in your make-believe world. I ain’t wake up you up. Sweet dreams!
sir even i had the same notion of varna..now jaati. but seriously its hard to tell the people who are still sitting on the top saying that they are brahmin…but how do we tell those people about it.
See Mahantesh if wrongs have been committed, there is no point hiding behind frail defenses. Such defenses will eventually collapse, but you will have to put things into the proper perspective. People have throughout history killed each other, humiliated each other, and done terrible things to each other. Indians were definitely no exception to this phenomenon. But if somebody exclusively targets us for being solely responsible for the crimes against humanity, you just need to show them the mirror. Even atheists are no exception: Remember the fate of devout Tibetans at the hands of the atheistic communist regime of China. Also, Joseph Stalin’s atheistic regime killed tens of millions of people. So, do we blame atheism for all these crimes?
When it comes to the Varna system, a lot has been said by Agniveer. It was never meant to be rigid. It was basically a division of labor and not of society but eventually things got murkier down the line and caused irreparable damage to the faith. The onus is on us to make sure that the misgivings about this system are dispelled.
[…] I call them wisdom books (not scriptures) because they are essentially guide books containing topics such as science, martial arts, ethics, maths, metaphysics and much more. You are given complete freedom to reject them without being threatened with eternal hell, unlike most of the world’s scriptures. And if anything, these books promote social hierarchy based on MERITS, rather than on birth as claimed by many brahmins today. But that’s a whole different topic. For those interested in digging deeper into it, I highly suggest reading Agniveer’s exposition here. […]
I want to thank you for providing a venue to discuss, dialogue, debate, inquire and have different view points for reflection. I truly appreciate it. Thank you!
love this site..has answered so many of my doubts.
wld like to say 1 thing.from what i have read abt my religion n the facts put forward till now.
the beauty abt it is its so open minded n is actually not a religion but way of life,for u n ur brothers(humanity)
humanity sld be the religion.
a muslim,christian etc. anyone can be a hindu u dont need conversion.
sad that it has been manipulated n corrupted like others(islam, Christianity etc. )
all are gd,its just that they have been corrupted by MAN for his purpose.
agniveer
Just curious how r u able to keep this site growing.ur own money or donations.
also where did u get all ur info.do u know Sanskrit or have read frm a translation.
From my understanding Agniveer is not one person. It is made up of many many many many people both men and women. And donations are from people like you and me and many more. It isn’t funded by some billionaire, although it would be nice to. It is a grass root movement by frustrated Dharmic people who want to live a better life. Who are sick of the power hungry extremist forces from outside of India and extremist government in India trying to corrupt Dharmic values and principles. The people are not just fighting us, they are fighting with Dharam, the power of GOD. And every time those forces of destruction attack Dharam, they are just helping Dharmic groups like Angiveer grow. You my friend are proof of such a powerful movement.
Check out the donation sight on Agniveer. Any amount is welcome.
the young generation(19-25 yrs @2012) will definitely understand mr.angiveer ji’s vedic facts, but for their happiness, it is their parents who should start thinking of all this casteism, or else there would not b any kind of change in d society, which discriminates ppl based on their caste…
There is chance even to misuse the truth, by selfish guys. Ved means light,knowledge and ultimate truth.Present form of varn/caste system is not competitive like pristine time where every varn is to be earned and not attained by virtue of biological birth accident.Let’s practice the real form of the system in true spirit as per vedic knowledge.Thanks——
BULL SHIT and STUPID article..preaching KARMANTRA PRAVISTA..This vedic civilization of BHARAT is over now and the time if of VARNA SANKARAS as per GITA..now TWICE BORNS, DWIJATI are themselves involved in the production of such BASTARD progenies. And oh sorry, VARNA is by BIRTH only. Ther are ample references to prove that BRAHMAN,KSHATRIYA, VAISHYA,SHUDR is by birth and birth alone. But then, scriptrues are always read with a BIASED against BRHAMANS first, then BASTARD PROGENIES want to show that ALL ARE ONE, a stupid and foolish concept, always preaching ADHARMA through KARMANTRA PRAVITSTA, which is even a grave and bigger sin than foresaking the VARNA DHARMA.
I know you are not a Hindu or a Vedic person. I know you are probably a Christian or muz rat trying to breakup and spread hate between Dharmic people. Seriously your disgusting tricks will no longer work with us. Dharmic people are uniting and one family and no longer believe in caste in India or anywhere. Everyday castes of different backgrounds are uniting.
Hmmm. Could you enlighten us how do we verify that the author of this comment in name of Radhakrishna is himself a Brahmin and not a Bastard progeny? Because as per (ill)logic of this commenter, only those born as Brahmins have special sanskaars to understand and propagate Vedic truths and now most of us are BASTARDS. So let we all be first convinced that the writer is not a Bastard himself, as per his own line of ideology. SOme DNA reports would be more authoritative than empty rhetorics. As per our definition, those who insult others as BASTARDS and those who believe that those born in so-called Shudra families cannot study Vedas are the real Chandals. They deserve to be thrown out into jungles. Agniveer movement is committed to destroy the very essence of such shamefully stupid ideologies from very root. If we are wrong, first bring DNA proofs to verify your eligibility to comment on Vedas if you believe that Vedas are only for birth-based Brahmins.
Discrimination is wrong weather it was base on birth wise or profession wise.
“Discrimination is wrong weather it was base on birth wise or profession wise.”
Agreed. and it is also wrong based on race or if you are a man or women or if you a minority religion, like Hindu or Sikh, in the middle east including Saudi arabia, pakistan, iran, iraq, egypt, or any other country.
why did god create us
this article is well down. thank you for clearing my confusion. now can you prove these points. give us actual proofs from the vedas, like hymns and verse where you found this.
Is meat (other than cow) eating in general allowed in Hinduism or Vedas or not?
My understanding is that a body requires a good balance of Stavik, Rasvik and Tamsik food depending on whether our body is vaat, pith or kapha..
please comment…
Agniveer here is an article:
http://www.islamhinduism.com/responses/answering-agniveer/116-debunking-agniveer-textual-corruption-in-vedas
Now this person cannot deal with clear humane verses, nevertheless can this article be debunked
Thanks
@dogra
You should not waste time to debunk the kufrs. They are doing their duty for which they get money from their Arab Masters. Ali Sina can handle them single handedly. We need to propagate Vedic Knowledge to the grass root level. Ali Sina is Hanuman of this era and Agniveer have to play role of Rama TO kill the Islamism from the people heart.
Think would be better to provide a rebuttal to verses they have used, to give them no leg to stand on, not that they have a secure leg in the first place.
Their attemptes are lame, but good to have rebuttal for the masses
@dogra
__________Think would be better to provide a rebuttal to verses they have used,____________
Do whatever I said you above. Do not argue. Because I am last prophet. And doubting/questioning to prophet leads to hell.
This is for you
What Makes a Muslim Human
http://alisina.org/blog/2012/03/07/islam-the-religion-ofs-moral-relativism/
i agree with you that guy is liar and he knows it
thanks for shedding light.
First thing i would like to ask you… if there is no cast system,then what are the 4 spiritual and physical classes in vedas?
2 Can you explain me the term varna asram from the vedas?
3. You said that a brahmin who doesn’t complete brahmic education is classified as a sudra. Well its not a sudra but is called Dvija-bandhu
4. I don’t find the title suitable to this article,You are discussing about cast system but the title mention cast system does not exist,you could have told us precisely your opinion of why it doesn’t exist,you should not have debated about the cast system if you don’t believe it exists
First thing i would like to ask you… if there is no cast system,then what are the 4 spiritual and physical classes?
Can you explain me the term varna asram from the vedas?
3. you said that a brahmin who doesn’t complete brahmic education is classified as a sudra. Well its not a sudra but is called Dvija-bandhu
4. I don’t find the title suitable to this article,You are discussing about cast system but the title mention cast system does not exist,you could have told us precisely your opinion of why it doesn’t exist,you should not have debated about the cast system if you don’t believe it exists
@D.Tushaar : Actually the word “Caste” is no where in the indian scriptures. there is only the jati and varna.
for the varna system read Satyarth prakash by Swami dayanand.
Respected Agniveer Ji !
AND PRANAMS ANYONE WHO READS THIS
I have a doubt. I hope you are aware of Abhivaadaya (A verse stating the Lineage and identity of a person).
Now let us assume a Shudra becomes a Brahamin by occupation ,
1) Can He perform Vedic Rites
2)What Veda will he follow ?
3)What will his abhivadaaya contain? (ie. What rishi, sutra ,adhyaaya….)
Actually I am a Brahamin and all the vedic rites require the recital of Abhivaadaya . Moreover a person is considered as a Brahamin only If he does Sandhyavandhanam (But nowadays So called BRAHAMINS DON’T DO IT )
So again if you don’t do Sandhyavandhanam , you are not a Brahamin.
But My sanskrit Master said that One family ceases to become Brahamin ,if 3 successive generations don’t do sandhyavandhanam .
Now Again , Will that person be able to initiate upanayanam to his son ?
Can you clarify these Doubts
Adityaji
All these are manmade rules and not confirmed by Vedas. In a society facing lots of flux, less of scientific education and having significant information asymmetry, these may have served some role. But among enlightened ones, these rules are redundant. For example, as children, you are taught to hold hands of your elder while walking on streets. But if you continue the same even as a 25 years old, that would be sign of psychological problems.
The basis of Vedic religion is reasoning. The basis of current religion being propagated as Hinduism is “follow snippets from history at expense of reason’. So you do something simply because it is written somewhere or someone good in Sanskrit told you this. This is antithesis of Vedic religion. Had it worked, would not our society have been the most powerful lighthouse of world today?
In reality, every person is Shudra, Vaishya, Kshatriya or Brahmin depending on his mindset and tasks he is doing at any point in time. So these Varnas represented properties. But if one focuses on one kind of activities, he is termed a particular Varna. Over period, job roles became more complex and dynamic. So this classification for each person became difficult. So they associated it with birth. This was a step backwards. This was like refusing to solve a problem because it is tough. This then started all these fake emphasis on birth-based rites etc. Vedas mention none of them.
So every human can perform Vedic rites. Every human should follow all the Vedas to whatever extent he can. Following does not mean recitation, but trying to understand meaning, and implement in life. Abhivadaaya is a later day creation. But if one wants, he can choose any of his choice depending on which sukta appeals him more.
Sandhya is compulsory for all as a good practice. But in later days because people started flouting the rule, they restricted it to birth-based Brhamins as a practical compulsion. But now a small minority alone does so, but they still are Brahmins! This itself debunks birth-based caste system.
Ask your master how does one prove that one is Brahmin or not. If one ceases to be Brahmin simply by not doing Sandhya for 3 generations, then one can become Brahmin also by doing Sandhya for 3 generations? Why not? What is the evidence for or against?
Why 3 generations? Why not 1 generation? Why not right now? WHo decided on three? What is the proof that this statement is given by God? Why should we believe in it? Cross question and you shall get your answers.
AgniveerJi !!
About the 3 generations , My teacher gave me an example (It is kind of long)
It was a common scene in the families of Indians (but not now) to have Great Grand parents . Our parents and elders play a very crucial role in molding us . We pay keen attention to them from a very small age and try to ape them . He gave me a Logical example for this 3 generation.
Now let us assume that there are 4 characters A(Great grand father) , B(Grand father) , C (Father) and D (Son)
Now if A,B and C Being Brahamins , do not do sandhyavandhanam (It is supposed to be the most important Duty of a Brahamin ) there is no way that D can actually learn to Do sandhyavandhanam .
During the initiation of Upanayanam , we consider our father as our Guru and he is the person who teaches us basic things like Sandhyavandhanam , Samithadhanam ,Gayatri Japa ,etc. Now If no elders follow any of the Vedic practices , Logically D has no access to these .
I can Give a live example of My own Life.
My Great Grand father did sandhyavandhanam , But my Grand father did not do sandhyavandhanam (I don’t know for what reason ) , But my Father does Sandhyavandhanam and even I do it. The reason why 3 generations is used is because even if B and C do not do sandhyavandhanam , D can learn it from A (Great Grand Father) but If 3 generations (ie. A, B and C ) do not do it , D has no access to these .He won’t have any one asking him to do these things nor will any one teach him the importance of these .
**************************************************************************************************************
My View Point;- (PLEASE GUIDE ME ON THIS AND POINT OUT FLAWS IN THEM)
I feel both Birth Based cast System and Occupation based cast system seems to be logical .
For. Eg. A person born in a Brahamin family has “more PROBABILITY” of being a Brahamin and moreover this sounds like a Fruit of your previous deeds (ie. Karma) . So going by the theory of Karma , we get the fruit of our previous births. This comes in the form of talents , opportunities and Luck .
A BRAHAMIN KID has MORE OPPORTUNITIES to be exposed to the VEDAS than a kid who is born in a Shudra Family . Now the Karma can be the ONLY reason why he is born into a Brahamin family .
Now It is upto the Kid to utilize that opportunity or waste it . But his decision determines his Varna later on . ie. His his GROWN as a Brahamin Kid (following the vedic practices) but turns into another Varna because of his decision .
CONCLUSION :- A PERSON IS BORN INTO A VARNA , BUT HE HAS THE DECISION TO CHANGE IT . SO BOTH BIRTH BASED AND OCCUPATION BASED VARNA IS LOGICAL .
And is the DHARMASHASTRA shruti or smriti . Can you quote few lines from that to make me understand much better .
P.S.
Agniveer Ji, don’t add a suffix “Ji” to my name . It makes me sound much older . I am just 18.
Thanks in Advance.
The dangers of probability based systems is that they are too brutal for the exceptional ones. If you have good family, you have more probability to be good. You can be good even without anyone formally embracing you as brahmin or whatever. But what about the exceptions where one is born to Shudra but is brahmin by deeds. Why should he wait for 3 generations? If one is Brahmin or Shudra or whatever, who are others to give certificate for that? And who certifies these others?
Ask your teacher if a Shudra can become Brahmin in 3 generations? If yes, then caste is not birth-based but 3 generation based as per your teacher. If yes, then what is the proof that forefathers of brahmins of today were not Shudras 1000 years ago? Such systems are good for people who cannot understand and manage complex systems. For someone who can walk probably will reach his goal faster by running a bit. But for someone who knows how to drive a car, it would be a foolish decision to still waste time walking when he can reach 100 km in 2 hours.
Just analyze and you shall get your answers.
Thanks a Lot AgniveerJi , for opening my eyes. Thanks a lot
One more doubt. Sorry.
In favour of Birth Based Varna System :-
A person is born into a varna based on his karma . So he enjoys or surfers based on It. So Birth based Varna system works on the basis of Karma
In that case, a person refusing to accept birth-based caste system also took birth due to his karma. So rejection of Varna system also works on the basis of Karma.
Good discussion betwen Aditya and Agniveer
Birth based caste, made the social evil of caste we have today and this social evil must be vanquished so that each individual fullhy understands that they can become whatever their dreams take them, and with training and educztion they can become that which they dream and want.
We belong to one caste: Human.
Dograji , please don’t use the word caste . MAANAV JAATI . Human Race .
At least,After one studies and educates oneself even superficially on AUTHENTIC Vedic translation, we have the Uttardaayitva ,responsibility, to avoid using the word caste and “Varna” interchangeably .If we continue to do so ,we will be perpetrating the harm the invaders did in clubbing them together and dividing us .Let us be firmly established in our own hearts and heads first ,that Varna is not caste,jaati is not caste .Let us discard the redundant and culprit word caste(=discard, cast away).
Your hate speech against Indians, Hinduism and Hindus has no place here. Go spew your Hinduphobia elsewhere.
Wow, you claim you are a Dr., but your words show that you are totally uneducated. You talk about show science, but all your statements don’t show an ounce of science or proof. They were just simple empty statements to talk bad about Vedic people. You really are a sad person who chooses to attack everyone here. You need to grow up and act like a man for once. Why don’t you stop faking that you are some doctor and state your real name and profession. You proved to everyone you are a fake and a joke. Your hate speech is just that, pure and utter hate and filth.
It is a fake essay written by someone. Brhimins are th criminals of India and Arayans invaded India.And they slowly slowly enslaved the Dravidians the originals of India. Brhimins and Arayans coperated with Brahmins for Sects or varnas, they also coined scripture in order to follow the slavery or caste system.
The Brahmins have to be punished for their criminal activites of castism. India needs agood Hitler in order to hang all the caste providers especially the Brhmins
Well!!
Your logic is as stupid as you. Why the hell do you need to kill the Brahamins now ?? What did this people do?? Going by your logic , You should have killed the English , French and all other colonizers and you should have bombed persia and Afghanistan .
This is a forum for intellectual & healthy discussion and not a place for propagating your DK ideas .
@Admin, Please block these kinds of commenters who show no sense of intellectuality in their comments and people who show haterid.
A Hitler for India? You are calling for genocide. This is hate speech of the worst kind. Shame on you. You stupidly think there are no South Indians who consider Sanatana Dharma theirs as much as any North Indian. It was not until the British did any Indian consider themselves two different races. Aryan and Dravidian are both terms coined by British and they were originally terms to categorize languages not races. The Aryan invasion theory has long been debunked. You are spewing nothing but outdated nonsense that missionaries peddle to get Hindus to hate their ancestral faith and convert.
karunajeewan , sounds like you are karunanidhi’s illegitimate son.you are the first “brahmin(buddhijeewi apne ko samajhnewala )”. you should be hanged first , for spreading lies.
बुजदिल हैं जो शिकायत किया करते हैं
औरों से बस सवाल किया करते हैं
जिन्दा वो हैं जो दुनिया के सवालों का
अपने कर्म से जवाब दिया करते हैं..
ये देखो दोगले सेक्युलर हिन्दू का कारनामा
भाजपा नेता निकला गौ तस्कर
भोपाल। कटनी में गायों की तस्करी का एक ऐसा मामला सामने आया है, जिसमें आरोपी एक ऐसा व्यक्ति है जो भाजपा और बजरंगदल का नेता होने के नाते गायों की तस्करी के खिलाफ आंदोलन करता रहा है। गौसेवा प्रकोष्ठ का संयोजक है एवं गौशाला का संचालक भी।
पुलिस ने इसके दो साथियों सहित 158 गायों को भी बरामद किया है, जिन्हें तस्करी किया जा रहा था। स्लीमनाबाद के टीआई आरएस चौहान ने बताया कि थानांतर्गत कोंडिया गांव में ले जाए जा रहे 158 पशुओं के साथ विपिन बिलौहा, एमएल जैन और कंधी यादव को गिरफ्तार किया गया है।
उनके विरुद्ध गौवंश अधिनियम की धारा 469 में प्रकरण दर्ज किया गया है। आरोपी विपीन बिलौहा भाजपा के गौ सेवा प्रकोष्ठ का संयोजक बताया जाता है, हालांकि टीआई से इस बारे में पूछे जाने पर उन्होंने कहा कि मैं नहीं जानता, यह कौन है? आरोपियों को मंगलवार को कोर्ट में पेश किया जाएगा
अब गोरक्षा कौन करेगा ?
R.joshi
कम्युनल शब्द का अर्थ ही बदल दिया है लोगें ने अब भारत में , अगर मुस्लमान अपने मत ( इस्लाम ) के नाम पे वोट दे तो वोह वोह सेक्युलर कहलायेगा परन्तु इसी विचार धरा के अनुरूप एक हिन्दू वोट करे अर्थात जो पार्टी हिन्दू मतों का समर्थन करती हो तो वो कम्युनल कहलायेगा। यह सब कांग्रेस का किया धरा है और जब तक हर एक भारतीय इस बात को नहीं समझे गा उस समय तो भारत का अभ्युदय नहीं हो सकता
ॐ
meaning of the word “communal” has been perverted in Bharat, now a days.If a Muslim votes in the name of Islam (i.e for people who support the ideology of Islam) , he will not be branded as communal but will fall under the category of being purely secular (along with the politics associated with it) ; but if a Hindu votes on similar lines he will be branded and shunned as being communal, this is the doing of congress.., unless every bharatiya understands this , the rise of this nation is not possible.
Aum.
This is an excellent site to know more on our Ancient Wisdom, The Vedas….
awesome article man, i myself am “born in a brahmin family” (you know what i mean) but i never believed that there would be anything like “caste system” written in vedas. i always used to think that the vedas are just misunderstood. i always wanted to read all the vedas and other main hindu scriptures just to find out how ancient indian civilization actually worked. i respect my religion, and believe that our civilization used to be really great. after reading the vedas (in sanskrit) i would love to try and answer everyone who used to ask me about the indian caste system (since i live in norway) and i never had an answer since i myself didn’t know. but now when i know. i’ll atleast have an answer. thanks a lot dude.
There is no Hindu caste system. In Sanatana Dharma aka Hinduism there is non-heriditary Varna (Brahmin, Kashtriya, Vaishya, and Shudra). And there is Jatis aka communities that a person is born into (like being of Jewish, Irish, German community and heritage). Shudra is not the same as untouchable. There is no untouchability in Hinduism either.
Certain communities because of the jobs they did fit into one Varna or another. It was more fluid. Jatis moved up and down Varnas. The British tried to classify communities into one Varna or another. That tending to make Varna more rigid and hereditary, but that was not the purpose or nature of Hindu varna – neither meant for a whole community nor was supposed to be rigid and inherited.
Untouchability was practiced by Indians but it is neither unique to Hindus in India, other Indian religious communities did as well, nor unique to India (google it).
For those Indians in India, what should they put down on some of those documents, government or not, that ask for your caste. Should we just say on it none.
Agniveer are you aware of this:
http://nastikasmission.blogspot.co.uk/2011/01/exposing-hinduism.html
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HINDU CASTE SYSTEM
in Hindu scriptures there are four divisions of people 1-BRAHMAN (priest) 3.5%, 2-KSHATRIYA (warriors) 5.5%, 3-VAISHYA (business caste) 6%, 4-SHUDRA (serving caste to above three caste also called Achot and feet (they cant touch the food or anything of uper three classes) 85%.
majority of the Muslims of India, Pakistan and Bangladesh are converted form caste SHUDRA (serving caste) thanks to the caste system they recognize the truth of Islam.
the corrupted caste system has no sanctrion in Vedas, as all parts of the body work together in unison.
The Muslims who converted can return back as there is no birth based caste in Hinduism, and as lord Krishna says God resides in hearts of all beings-BG 10.20,
mr mohammad please do understand the vedas before commenting….i know islam a bit through my friend even misinterpretations can be made out of islam….hinduism being the most oldest religion suffers many alterations….but the true vedas do not carry any word caste
There is however a religious sanctioned Muslim caste system: Muslim men first, Muslim women second, men from the older two Jewish faiths (Judaism and Christianity) are next as 3rd class dhimmis, behind them as Jewish and Christian women, and way beneath them are the men of the dharmic faiths (Hinduism, Jainism, Buddhism, Sikhism, Zoroastrianism) and beneath them are the women of the dharmic faiths, and the lowest two are the other religions who do not get to be “dhimmis” men and beneath them the women of all the other religions like the Bahai and African animists.
This is the Muslim caste system that indeed IS religiously sanctioned.
This Muslim religion based caste system even is reflected not in only political and social status but also economic worth – See diyya or blood money http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diyya
majority of the Muslims of India, Pakistan and Bangladesh are converted form caste SHUDRA (serving caste) thanks to the caste system they recognize the truth of Islam.
Dear friend,
Shudra is not a caste, all are born as ignorant of knowledge as ‘Shudra’ to feed the nature as per their mental ability. After education, they acquire status in the society. The Brahaman, who guide the society with his sacrifice and knowledge, The Kshatriya, who defend the society from thieves, robbers and invaders by his weapons and healthy body, The Vaisya, who serve the society with business, and agriculture. It is mental classification of the human-beings in the society. It was not hereditary, but during long slavery of invaders rule, it become hereditary professional classification. The poor people were exploited, and the poverty under foreign rule forced them to adopt Islam with conversion for survival.
The British rulers have exploited the poor to attract them towards Christianity and forced them for conversion. The rulers were free to do any thing to convert Indians into their religion. Otherwise there was no religion in India like Christian or Muslim. Every body was free to follow his deep rooted traditions.without any code of conversion.
It has saved Indian culture, only. ‘The man is friend and foe of himself’ the life is eternal, The hell or heaven are on the earth it self with new birth. The Indian culture was misinterpreted during long slavery by the invaders to impose their superstition with divide and rule policy.
The politicians are following the same, to rule over India and Pakistan on mental slaves of Britain.
With regards
This is hate speech. Brahmins never ruled. Your pathetic state is due to your arab boot licking ., which u r shameless in flaunting. You are a sellout and traitor. Go change yourself first before u start finger pointing at the brahmins. U r just dumb!