Vedas and Shudra

your articles very nice to read, and hear… but again we are not slave or fool to believe….. that is good to see how you are alert every moment.

There is no caste or varna or vedas are good ok but how 3000 thousand of caste. if any sudra read mandara cut their tongue, or if he hear pour lead his ear…hahahahah..
anyway i dont want waste our time to read these kind of dirty articles. whoever believe this article thats their choice. All ways your group cheating us. that is not new.

Read below about hindu religion,
Inspite of education Brahmins practiced sati and widowhood for millenia. If you go to mathura, all the widow you see there are brahmin widows in white saree? Mostly from middle class educated families. On the contrary, Dalits were denied education for millenia, but Dalits are the only people in India, who never practiced sati or widowhood, widow remarriage is a very common culture among Dalits for ages. But, in case of educated Brahmins, someone like British has to come and tell them, that it is wrong. In the whole of India, it is the only Dalit culture, which is most liberal in terms of marraiage, sexuality and gender equality. You will hardly find any dowry deaths among dalits. The only problem of Dalits is denial of rights and atrocities on them by Hindus. It was Dr.Ambedkar (Dalit) who married a Brahmin woman and fought for the rights of brahmin women, gave them Rights to get Divorce, Right to inherit father’s property, Right to re-marry in form of Hindu code bill. These rights were denied to Brahmin women by their own men in all through Indian History. When Dr.Ambedkar introduced Hindu code bill, it was the English educated Brahmins who protested and opposed it tooth and nail, for which Dr.Ambedkar resigned from the Nehru’s cabinet? Why did english educated Brahmins behaved like this? Can you explain this paradox? Can you give me an example of a Liberal, educated Brahmin leader marrying a Dalit girl and fought for the Dalit rights? In case, if any Brahmin does this in future no Dalit will oppose him, like educated brahmins opposed Dr Ambedkar’s fight for Brahmin women rights.

Shall I explain you this paradox?????
So, with full confidence I am writing you all these. The actual problem is, the present day educated, urban innocent Hindus don’t know about their own religion. To them Hinduism is a Noble religion. This Noble impression they got because of Swami Vivekananda (SV) and Sri Aurobindo (SA). These 2 saints, very good at heart had actually what they propagated was Upanishad part of Hinduism, which was discarded by Brahmins Long ago. Carefully Notice all the saints who popularized Upanishadic philosophy are Non-Brahmin upper caste like SV. Actually what Hinduism teaches? What is the literature of Hinduism? Traditionally Hindus Religious lore is divided into 2 groups of Books.
(We can have a detail debate on this).

Hinduism’s Religious Literature fall into two groups of Books.

Six Orthodox Hindu philosophies

Group I : Shruti

Group II : Smriti

1) Nyaya

2) Visheshika

3) Mimansa

4) Sankhya

5) Vedanta

6) Yoga

1) Vedas (Rig, Artharva,

Yajur and Sama)

2) Aranyakas

3) Brahmanas

4) Upanishads

1) Shastras

2) Puranas

3) Sutras

4) Ithihasas

These two groups (Shruti and Smriti) together sum up the six ancient orthodox philosophies of Hinduism. All the books under Shruti and Smriti were produced by Brahmins themselves except the Aranyakas and Upanishads, which were produced by Kshatriyas. This was the reason why there was fight between Brahmins and Kshatriyas, right from the ancient History of India. The best example is of the fight between the Brahmin Vasistha and Kshatriya Vishwamitra. Since, Upanishads were produced by Kshatriyas, Brahmins did not like them and hence, they called them as Vedanta (Upanishads) meaning Veda + anta, anta in Sanskrit means “End or Border”. So, the meaning of Vedanta (Upanishads) is Books outside Vedas. Such, was the contempt Brahmins had towards the Upanishads by calling them as Vedanta. Why Brahmins hated Vedanta (Upanishads), just because they were produced by Kshatriyas? No, Brahmins hated Upanishads for two reasons, first, because of the kshatriya origin of the books, second, for it’s contents. This raises a question, what does Upanishads teach. There are about 108 Upanishads, some important, some quite unimportant. What ever may be it, what do they teach? What is there in Upanishads which made Brahmins call it with a derogatory word “Vedanta”? The Kshatriya Rishis of Upanishads discovered that every being has an “Atman” which is derived from “Paramatman” (Brahman). The Paramatman was the all-pervading principle which binds the universe and the salvation lay in the Atman realizing that is Paramatman. The main thesis of Upanishads was that Paramatman was a reality and that Atman was the same as Paramatman. The Atman did not realize that it was Paramatman because of the Upadhis (Obstacles) in which it is entangled. Since, every being has the same Atman derived from Paramatman, so all men are equal. This is where Brahmins could not accept the equality of all men; this is the reason why they hated Upanishads with the name Vedanta. Hence, Upanishads were never part of Vedas; they were un-canonical in all through the history.

For our argument sake let us divide the Hinduism as two parts, one part is the Books produced by Brahmins and the other part is the Books produced by Kshatriyas. Kshatriyas produced the Upanishad philosophy, which is all men are equal. The philosophy that Brahmins produced is the Vedic philosophy, that is all men are unequal, which later got popularized as Shastras and Puranas. So, the bed rock of the Upanishads is equality, whereas the bed rock of Puranic (Vedic) is inequality. Brahmins developed a common culture around this Puranic (Vedic, Shastras) philosophy, which was based on inequality. At the same time brahmins never allowed Upanishad philosophy to become a common culture and ethics of Indian society, because any attempt to develop a culture around Upanishads would lead into equalizing the society. So, Upanishads just remained as a mere philosophy, never became the culture of India. So, the mass of Hindus all through the History were under the spell of puranic Hindusim, that is the reason why Brahmins could survive unchallenged holding temples. All the rituals, which Hindus follow at home and temples today is in the puranic style, not the Upanishadic way. Dowry, Sati, Widowhood, Child marriages, Agni-pariksha, Husband-worship etc all these are the part of the Puranic Hinduism culture. These kinds of activities Brahmins made it as Civil law of the society through Shastras, thus sanctifying the Puranic Hindusim legally. Whereas, Upanishadic Hindusim could not develop any rational civil law, as it could not create a culture around it due to Brahmin opposition.

The other religion which fought the Puranic Hindusim in the History was Buddhism. To counter Buddhism, Brahmins employed various measures for a very long time. One, they used Muslims to kill Buddhism, Second, they themselves became Buddhist monks and distorted the Buddhism, Third, Brahmins saints with the help of some soldiers killed Buddhist monks (example Adi Shakaracharya killed Buddhism in south india by killing Buddhist monks). Fourth, produced Bhagavat Gita to counter Buddhism in the name of Krishna. Bhagavat Gita is nothing but a distorted mixture of Sankhya and Vedanta philosophy to defend the caste system. They did it in the name of Krishna. Sankhya and Vedanta philosophies haven’t crystallized very well at the time of Krishna, then how did Krishna use these two philosophies?? From this itself it is clear that Bhagavat Gita was produced by Brahmins, to counter Buddhism. It is surprising to see, why Brahmins used Vedanta (Upanishads) philosophy in Bhagavat Gita which they hated. If we read the Bhagavat Gita carefully, one can notice the Vedanta philosophy is distorted in such a way to defend the caste system. This is how Brahmins prevented Upanishad philosophy, Buddhism to take roots in Indian soil, whereas they nurtured Puranic Hindusim culture thoroughly.

If today, common Hindus practice dowry, Agni-pariksha, Caste system etc it is not because they are not educated, it is because they are following the culture of their puranic Hindusim which is taught to them for centuries. Here, the problem is not education it is the cultural notions of their own religion Hindusim. It was only Dalits who did not accept the puranic Hindusim that was the reason why Brahmins condemned them as untouchables. This is the reason why in Dalit culture, there is no widowhood, Agni-pariksha etc, because they did not accept Puranic Hindusim. This is the reason why educated Brahmins opposed Dr Ambedkar’s Hindu code bill, because Dr. Ambedkar was attacking the Puranic Hindusim, which is the culture of Brahmins. How can Brahmins allow the demolition of their own culture which they nurtured for centuries?

It was only during the time of Swami Vivekananda (SV), some attempt was made to popularize the Upanishad (Vedanta) Hinduism. During this time the meaning of Vedanta changed from Books outside Vedas, became the Essence of Vedas. Today Vedanta (Upanishads) is called as Essence of Vedas. This was the service done by SV, he tried to attack the Puranic Hindusim and develop Upanishadic Hindusim into a culture. But, before this became a reality, suddenly he dies at a very young age of 39, without any ill-health or disease. His death is still a mystery? Now, some urban educated Hindus got an opportunity to know about the culture of Upanishads, so they think Hindusim is a very Noble religion. Such, kind of Hindus, when they see people in the grip of Puranic Hindusim doing bad things, they cannot understand, they think it is not because of religion, it is because of lack of education or backwardness.

So, I guess now you understand what I am arguing. The principle problem of India is not education; it is the culture of Puranic Hindusim which is responsible for all the problems in India. Now, the question is the Enlightened, Learned, Good, and Secular Brahmins are they ready to demolish the Puranic Hindusim and Glorify the Upanishadic Hindusim? Are they ready to develop a common public psychology, culture and ethics around Upanishads? The future of India depends upon the answer-action to this question. Dalits are the only people in India, who are ever ready to demolish the Puranic Hindusim, are there any Good Brahmins left who want to join their camp?

Do you have any answer?

It is clearly evident from the puranic literature and historic event that some sort of complex prevailed between the Varna group and it is continuing even to-day. But from the beginning till to-day the entire blame is put on Brahmin whose population is very negligible in the society. Hence without the support of other Varna people it is not possible to introduce any changes or ruling in the society. Whatever good or bad happened in Hindu society the prize/blame should be shared by the three Varna people excluding powerless Sudra? No human being is devoid of hereditary trait. It is natural that Ambedkar findings are to some extent biased putting the entire blame on Brahmin. Even Vivekananda also done this blaming Brahmin one sided. I am also wondering how the Brahmin haters forget the atrocities done by the invaders continuously for 1500 years, extending their support till to-day for them and blindly digging their own grave.

Also I read in some books that the original name of Ambedkar is Bema Rao. A Brahmin teacher named Ambedkar helped him in his studies. Ambedkar changed his name as Bema Rao Ambedkar (B.R.Ambedkar) as a remembrance of loyalty shown by the teacher. Also for his higher studies one Mr.Arjun Kelusker a Brahmin took him to the Raja of Gaighuward and arranged funds. Also he married a Brahmin lady as a second wife during end period of his life. I don’t know how far these information are correct. Having mingled with Brahmin in his life how he has taken the stand of putting the entire blame on Brahmin alone is really perplexing.

Dear Tamilji,

Namaste,

Thanks for sharing in your thoughts.

It was interesting reading your point of view on how Caste system evolved, differing concepts of Vedas and Upanishads, role of Brahmins and the status of Dalit.

But my question is Where form Here ? What is the role model for the society to follow from here on?

Dear sir;

I think you mistake social evil from what was past. Social evils actually are not from religion like Vedas, or Upanishads, but are from human ignorance.

In any society there will be classes of people the ruling elite, warriors, labor, educated, business classes.Whether we look at English, American, European, Russian, Chinese, Japanese, communist etc. This is basic structure of large societies, but we do not call them caste based societies. In fact there is an caste system outside India called doctors,lawyers, scientist, politicians, and it is too inherited to some degrees as educated tend to remain educated. There will be class conflict always, as no one would like to think anyone is superior or inferior. But in Hindu dharma stories of Shudra, Brahmin, Kshatriyas, Vaishyas, Assura, getting mokesh is common place which is the highest achievement for Hindus.

Remember unless they received full 25 years brahmacharya having the respective qualities of Brahmin, Viahsya, Shudra, Kshatriyas,then and only then could they be classified as such otherwise they were all born shudra.Only person who posses those above qualities and this is not birth based.

We in this perspective must see history. I recently procured a book called “ProtoHistory :Archaeology of the Harappan Civilization”2004 published by ICHR, S.Settar, Ravi Korisettar, this book was very clear that what you call Ayran Invasion is very much a fraud that it was the Swarswati River civilization, the People living there was indigenous, that over 1,000,000 km2 area was covered whereas the before theory in 1947 covered a few sites of Indus now over 1000 sites are discovered compared to Egypt where only 15,000 sq km of being only but far more excavated.It largest ancient civilization know to man. In fact migration more likely to Europe because of this fact then invasion. Infact the say there is period of time of resettlement.. That the British time when so called Indus valley civilization making false claims as the remains were by natural death not by butchering, most of them worshiped in fire alters similar to Vedic Hindus.

Bur most interesting of these societies they were first to have water supplied to every house, they did not have a culture haves and have not, and their evidence in areas like Punjap that there is continuation of culture.Also Like Dwarka in Mahabhara some exist Drawka where the Mahabharat wrote. So there is too much evidence it is history of Hindus.

We believe us Hindus this Kali Yuga individuals are not of such character to tell truth. Hindus believe in history of millions of years and say their history is continuous. What verifies this is scientific evidence. Further what say they were technology better is they say they knew more about plants, and animals then we know today, what is the proof this that most science have got the basic of medicines, plants and animals from these ancient people and still continue this stealing called Bio-piracy. Great libraries were burnt down for over six months like the nine story Nalanda confirm that today is the Dark ages and usher in such an age in India..Even today we have no such large libraries relative to our population.

Now you blame Hindus for Muslim killing Buddhist, but do you blame them for killing Hindus that they do even today with the Kashmir Hindu population by giving them one days notice to leave.Creation of Pakistan, Afghanistan where Muslim do the same speaking of genocide of both Hindus and Buddhist including their mandhirs who make a percent of population.

Dear Tamil face the fact that the British were racist pigs they would never call a dark skin person an Aryan which they considered themselves to be. The North Indian with lighter skin they though but not the South Indian. You are a victim of fiction so what you say is hypocritical.

Further British lied, yes Hindus in this modern world called Kali yoga are corrupt they are not like the Swarswati Civilization. People are inhuman cruel, greedy, corrupt. There is destruction all around as they say it is the biggest extinction period millions of species have been extinguished and large portion of the earth have turned to desert due to the evil people do in last 2000-3000 years.. People listen to their mafia dons, bollywood not to educated to commercials on TV. They listen to corrupt like Nehru who partitioned the country, back stabbed Mahatma Gandhi, slept with Mount Batten wife who introduced such theories to Indian society. They are weak and low in character unable even to practice Brahmachary.

Respect Agniveer, as they are tiring to take India out of Dark ages and live her glory, not live in the time of British racism and Bigotry, or where ignorance is predominate. It is time raise again to be the most truthful country, the most crime free, the place where everyone wanted to go, the country with the largest exports who know throughout the world for not the measly one percent, Histories most powerful nation,The richest most educated country of the world, not of Babus, criminals, and poverty..

@vedamgopal
Please add me to the brahmin haters list… Because

You speak about attrocities of Invaders, I know they were & are horrible.. but you must accept that this was that gift given by orthodox brahmins who designed birth-based cast.. by which Ravan like wicked minded became brahmins.. and impotents became kshatriya how could they protect Bharath matha…

As arabindo said ‘whatever attrocities my mother (bharath matha) faced is because of selfish brahmins and arrogant kshatriyas’..

For all those murders, rapes, infanticides, burning, temple destruction, looting are the gift of the great brahmins.

@Tamil : Frnd, We do not believe in the puranas, they have no credibility and are man made, they are to be outright discarded
Please read SatyaPrakash by Rishi Dayanand Saraswati., It can be found on this portal itself, please check the home page

Tamil get out of from the trap of fake books and understand vedas.

LTTE was a terrorist organization and thanks GOD it has been destroyed. They believed in stupid aryan invasion myths and had hatred towards hindus.

LTTE cjief Prabhakaran was a Christian though he behaved like a Marxist-Leninist violent idelogy. He had no compassion and lived a royal princely life with a fortified state in Sri Lanka having wealth to the tune of about two thousand crores.

“The LTTE is not just anti-Sinhala, they are anti-Buddhists as well. And in this, they do seem to have a holy pact with certain sections of the Catholic Church and countless evangelical outfits all over the country.
…
The point is that the missionaries have historically been part and parcel of the colonial project. That project, now called Globalisation, is still incomplete. It includes the erasure of all cultures outside the ambit of Judeo-Christian bigotry. It is in this context that the efforts of Christian Evangelical Alliances or whatever else they may want to call themselves, have to be viewed. And opposed.” Please peruse the link: http://www.deeppencil.com/news-politics/page2/
There are plenty of references but Wikipedia is silent on his Christian identity. Reason is very obvious.
Church has been most vicious all over the globe and this caste business is perpetration of Church with a vested interest in conversion. In all the current Middle East crisis there is a underhand of Church for proselytisation. Unfortunate. They operate very carefully in hidden manners so that their role is not easily discerned.

Namaste and Vanakkam brother.

I’m a Tamil from Sri Lanka.

Vedas are the only texts of Sanatana Dharma and the only Shruti texts, hence one should live his/her life according to Vedas and not other texts such as Puranas.

Sati and the other social problems you mentioned are just that, social problems. They have no link to the actual Hinduism (Sanatana Dharma).

Vedas are what should be followed first and the other smriti texts such as Upanisads should be accepted as per Vedas. Anything in a smriti text that doesn’t agree with what Vedas say should be rejected.

The LTTE was nothing but a way to kill off Hindus, headed by (no surprise here) a christian (Prabhakaran was a christian). No one should support such an organisation, especially not a Hindu.

About LTTE being an anti-Hindu organization. Nonsense. To the best of my knowledge, Prabhakaran’s marriage was held according to Hindu religious rites in a temple in Tamil Nadu. Also LTTE was fighting against the Buddhist-chuavinist Sri Lankans and espousing the cause of SL Tamils, a majority of whom are Hindus, and so it couldn’t afford to be anti-Hindu anyway. Of course, due to its Marxist and other modern ideologies’ influence, it may have opposed many existing Hindu customs, etc. which any reformist / radical organization will do.

Thank you Tamil,
I think the learned, intelligent people like you are very less in our society and those who are there, are not coming forward because of their own caste benefit. Now its high time that we all should start a mission to tell the truth to open the eyes of the our so called religious authorities which only save this beautiful religion and and our nation. This is the only way to stop conversions to other religion. But I am sure Bramhins will not allow this to happen because in the past whenever somebody like Bhagwan Buddha, Saint Dnyaneshwar (12th century) Saint Ravidas (15th century) Saint Tukaram (17th century) and now Swami Vivekanand and Dr B R Ambedkar tried to do this either they were severely opposed or finished. It is a fact in the present scenario there is 100% reservation to 3% Bramhins for economically and socially important temple posts like priesthood and Shankaracharyas where there is unlimited flow of money (without paying income tax). It is natural that they are going to use all there powers so that their income sources (without efforts) will be maintained in the Indian society.

Nice work man , i agree with you

Dear Tamil,

Your comments have some truth. However, the truth you are talking about is limited to people’s behavior. Not idea. The Vedas and the Upanishads as not opposed to each other. It is true that Brahmins at one point messed it up. But that does not discredit the Vedas and the Upanishads. Since you are asking for names, one name I can give who has been like a sun to many. Bhagawan Ramana Maharshi of Tiruvannamalai was a Brahmin. Read his life story.

Ok, In vedic times there was no birth caste thats every one know, and it must be a better(equal?) than puranic hinduism.But let us also see whats the big difference ‘tween Vedic and puranic hinduism.
Vedic- they eat meat even zebu beef(although they praised one who doesn’t).
Puranic-they strictly popularised vegetarians.
Vedic-The local god(of adivasis and villages were not included
Puranic- They included all gods of popular belief
Any one has to sy something about these puranic as far as i believe are beter than vedics over these two atleast.
No offence,pure comment

This Tamil guy begets children from his own mother (poda Thaazhezhi).

Nice and logical debate…

This Tamil is suffering from half knowledge which is more dangerous than no knowldge.

1) if there was war between vishwamitra & vasishta, there shud hv been battles.
2) agni pariksha reference in ramayana is between ram & sita. Neither families were brahmin families
3) the person who wrote vedas himsef was not a brahmin. Every brahmin reading vedas know that veda vyasa was a tribe and yet sing his praise. This proves all this accusation of caste discrimination and hatred is imaginary & propagated my pseudo intellectuals synthesised by church & macaulay types.
4) vivekananda had TB. He was a smoker. All RK mutt swamijis including brahmin born swamis in RK mutt know this. To suggest brahmins killed vivekananda in conspiracy is outrageous.
5) ambedkar is not his original lastname. The ambedkar name was given to bhim rao in his college days by his teavher who’s name was ambedkar. His teacher(brahmin named ambedkkar) gave bhim rao his own name to ensure that his dalit sounding family name does not hinder his path to success. Obviously Mr Tamil will verify this, curse himself.

1) I don’t understand what you are saying. But that there was serious rivalry and fight between Viswamitra and Vasishtha is recorded in Puranas and we read it in text books even in our childhood. Viswamitra became a Rajarshi but would not become a brahmarshi unless Vasishtha agrees to it, etc. and Vasishtha’s reluctance and Viswamitra’s own arrogant and angry nature led to all the fight – that’s what we read.
2) That is true.
3) But Vedavyas is deemed a Brahimin, not only due to his learning but also due to his birth (or half-birth). Vedavyas is son of Parashara Maharshi and Satyavati (a fisher-woman). Parashara was son of Sakti Muni and Sakti was son of Vasishtha Maharshi. So on the father’s side Vyas was of Brahmin origin. Vyas sired Dritharashtra, Pandu and Vidura with Amba, Ambalika and a maid , and with his own wife he begat Suka Maharshi.
4) Vivekananda’s guru Ramakrishna was a brahmin. May be there was some grouse among Brahmin followers of Ramakrishna that none of them but a Kayastha (Vivekananda) became the successor of Ramakrishna, but to suggest that Vivekananda was killed by their conspiracy is too much. I have not found such allegations to this day anywhere and even Wikipedia does not contain even a reference to such allegations.
5) Ii is true that the Brahmin teacher of Bhimrao gave his suffix of Ambedkar to him and thence Bhimrao became more known as Ambedkar. But the reasons for that teacher doing so are not so clear. However, he helped his pupil very much and I don’t know whether Ambedkar ever later referred to him in respectful terms and paid homage.

Scroll down to the very end and read my comments in 3 parts.. The summary of my stand is this. Varna system adovcated by hinduism is the perfect merit based system which any ideal advanced society should aspire to.

Society grades occupations based on skill and sphere of influence. In your blind hate for casteism and anti-hindu propaganda, you are suggesting all occupations are equal. If that was the case, would you suggest equal pay for the scientist and the garbage collector? No occupation is lowly, but that doesn’t imply all occupations are treated the same. There should be dignity of labour.

Hi Tamil
this is the best logical extracts from history, i have ever read. thanks! for post

Answers? you expect answers to all your trash you vomited out here on that moron Ambedkar and the more moronic Brahmins (casteist) ? You should become a comedian, for all the jokes you have cracked above.
You must be a fan of that troll Periyar for only liars like him and his followers can bark such garbage and lies.

Suggestion: better don’t make a joke out of yourself by farting (e.g. Dalits treat women better than Brahmins do, when actually all leading women are Brahmins and other upper castes)

Q. Suggestion: better don’t make a joke out of yourself by farting (e.g. Dalits treat women better than Brahmins do, when actually all leading women are Brahmins and other upper castes).
A: Sir, You have not able understand the truth, you do not know what is the power behind all the leading women of brahmin and other uper caste. That power was HON’BLE SAVITRI BAI PHULE & HER HUSBAND HON’BLE JYOTIBA RAO PHULE , Who was the FIRST women authorised teacher in India and who start first women school in India (Maharstra Pune) for shudra’s girls and all Brahmin and upper caste oppose this and they Barked Dharam ki lutiya doob jayegi agar aurten shiksheet ho gayi. In Hindu Dharma education is totaly ban for Women and Shudras. Hindu/Brahmin torture physically and mentally to Ms.Phulle ji , After that all the women Brahmins/Hindus/Aryas start get education. Before Ms.Phulle no women education school was not available in India.

YOU KNOW WHO WAS HON’BLE SWITRI BAI PHULLE , SHE WAS A SHUDRA WOMEN OF MAHARASHTRA
SHE AND HER HUSBAND OPEN THE DOOR FOR 80% INDIANS I.E. WAS WOMEN AND SHUDRA. SIR, THIS IS NOT A JOKE THIS IS REALLITY OF UR AND UR FOREFATHERS. AGAR YE THEEK HOTE TO GAURI, GAJNI, BABER DEKHNE KI HIMMAT NHI KAR SAKTE THE.

Q.You should become a comedian, for all the jokes you have cracked above.
A: Deshmukh sir, this is not comedy , this is 101% really fact that ALL THE WOMEN OF INDIA OF TOAL POLUTATION =50% APPROX. AND ALL THE SHUDERA = 35% APPROX FOR TOTAL POPULATION OF TOTAL POPULATION OF INDIA, TOTAL 85% APPROX.
Hon’ble Jyoti Rao Phule aur unki Patni Hon’ble Switri Bai phule ne shuder hote hua Bhart ki 85% population ke liye shiksha ke dwar khol diye, jis ka parman aaj ki aap stya ke roop me dekh rahe ho. Hindu katter pantiyo ne sabhi aurato ki shiksha par ban laga rakha tha chahe vo Brahmin ho, Akshtriya ho, Vaise ya shuder. Jo kam 2 logo 150 sal me kar dikhaya ye kam Hindu/Brahmin/Arya/Ved/Geeta Ramayan hazaro salo me nhi kar paye. Deshmukh Sir, I m not barking I have proof, if you do not believe me then go to net and search about Hon’ble Jyoti Rao Phule aur unki Patni Hon’ble Switri Bai phule and also search about Ram Shambuk, Darona Eklavya, Inder Ahilya, Parsuram Karan and also search about Matadin and Mangal Pandey. Sir, ho skata hai mai galat hoon, lekin net par dharmik pustko me yahi mil raha hai, aur hum apni nayi generation ko dikha rahe hai vo khud hairan hai and ask waht is this, Sir, Ek Channel par hum sab ne MAHADEV serial dekha, jis me Inder devta mata Ahilya ka suhba 4 baje Gutam rishi ke jane ke bad Chander devta ki sahayta se blatakar karta aur pakde jane par Gutam Rishi Inder devta ka chehra kala kar deta hai aur Ahilya ko Pathar ki bana dete hai.
sir, is par kisi bhi hindu ya uske sangthan ki koi partikirya nhi aayi ki yeh galt hai fir ye 100% satya hai. Only may be 1 or 2 % truth is Hinduism so you are requested to remove this 98-99% garbage and help aal of us.
Thank you Sir,

Dear Agniveer,
OK let us assume that Dr BRA assessed Vedas through Tampered (English) translation and we will discuss what you have translated above in YAJURVEDA 20.17. You read it again, it is very clearly mentioned that Shudras and Vaishyas should forgive for the crimes against them. That means surely they agreed that crimes were conducted in those days against Vaishyas and Shudras otherwise what for forgiveness?
It is very clearly written in your text only now you cant blame europian Indologists. You will still have some polished words to explain in your dictionary but no intelligent person will believe it.

@Dr I. Avinash

‘ That means surely they agreed that crimes were conducted in those days against Vaishyas and Shudras otherwise what for forgiveness?’

What do you mean by “those days” ?

It is clearly mentioned that varna system is entirely merit based instead of birth-based as currently practised and Shudra is a profession category of Arya or those people who are indulged in benevolent acts.
Say, if you chuck out your nurse for no fault of his/her and later on you repent your decision for what you did. Would you not pray to God to forgive & relieve you from the tendency of repeating it again ??

Seems like you just want to continue with your rant against the Vedas otherwise I see no reason as to why a MBBS graduate would find it so difficult to understand a simple thing mentined in Yajurved 20.17

agneeveer, he was scholar in sanskrit and he knew hidden meaning of the word. you are a pebble and he was ocean of the knowledge. I know that you are brahmin and you want to save your society which depends on illogically back ground… even you dont know about parmatma. and, so you have found the das avtara which were not incarnation of parmatma, if parshuram was incarnation of god then why he killed many innocent people. So dont blaim on the mahapurush B.R. Ambedkar . if he was not born india then you will rule and punish the innocent people. you are raksha not brahman yuo have to accept now and apologize.

Babaji, Baba Ambedkar has himself admitted that he did not know Sanskrit and relied on European translations to interpret Hindu texts. Das Avatara, Parashuram etc are models of belief. Being Hindu has nothing to do with these beliefs. You may accept or reject them. Many Hindus believe in formless God, many in form, many in both, many in nothing. And Agniveer accepts and apologizes for being unable to destroy enemies of Hinduism as effectively as it had dreamt of. May God grant us strength to fulfill this mission in no time. We are happy to have you as a partner in this mission.

True, he has painstakingly provided the cloth. Let us iron out the creases.

"Nonetheless, I appreciate Ambedkar for his dalit-upliftment efforts even though he failed to provide a true direction to this movement due to his prejudices."
No. Actually, he rubbished the Aryan Invasion Theory and provided a true direction to the movement. He wanted Dalits to get this AIT out of their heads so that they can be properly integrated in hindu society. Todays Dalits dont read hios books and simply parrot the AIT as taught to them by political v vested interests.

I agree on this point. He was completely against Invasion Theory. And his initial writings were close to Vedic view. But he digressed later a bit. For example, he continued to condemn Manu instead of acknowledging that the controversial verses were clearly adulterated. Many Arya Samaj leaders did gave him this evidence, and perhaps he admitted to it on a few occasions, but he continued his diatribe against Manu, and not only present Manu Smriti. Similarly, he well knew about adulteration of Ramayan and that Uttar Ramayan is completely fake. He also knew the truth of Purans. But he used these to write in detail to try to prove that Ram and Krishna were illegitimate, drunkards, womanizers and what not. I understand that his hatred was against casteist forces. But he drifted so much in his bias that ultimately he became a Buddhist, rejecting Vedas and Vedic concepts.

Refer <a href="http://www.ambedkar.org/riddleinhinduism/21A1.Rid…” target=”_blank”>http://www.ambedkar.org/riddleinhinduism/21A1.Rid…

It also shows how biased was Ambedkar against Vedas, despite having no knowledge of Sanskrit and knowing very well about intentions of western indologists on whom he based his conclusions. Perhaps he got bit to carried away with his hatred.

@anand
‘Todays Dalits’ who are they???
It might be you..
and who are ‘todays other varnas’??
It is foolish to finger at one and say he is this varna, and act as learned of Vedas or non-biased philosophy..

@Tamil great work buddy…
But Adi Shankara was Vedantist.. isn’t he? And I am not sure about he killing buddist monks..

@agniveer
honestly you (none) of you replied to Tamil as learned people; some showed up with again their shit here.. Vedas the Truth blah blah.. I don’t want to see it in articles but in the behaviour of commentors also.. till then I don’t consider none of you as believer of humanity, equality forget about understanding Vedas..

I didn’t even got reply from you about ‘Sapinda’ northindian & southindian differences…

Commentors I expect more honesty & morality; I want see influence of Vedas in your actions don’t just limit them to articles please…

thanks..

@VivekanandaInsp

—-I didn’t even got reply from you about ‘Sapinda’ northindian & southindian differences…——
Agniveer answered your query, i guess! Follow the link.
http://agniveer.org/showthread.php?tid=167

@shravak
Thanks
I thought I would get mail notification but didn’t got so.. I thought it was not replied..

@VivekanandaInsp

hmm…a sincere advice to you, do not post comments in haste here. Before reading the articles of Agniveer.com first read about the project Agniveer. what’s it purpose? Don’t be in a rush. They are not running a crash course here. You have to be patient. And remember the part ‘unleash the legend within’. AND “They don’t promise to answer everything. They merely help you seek the right questions. The answers lie within you. Let the discovery begin…”

@anand
‘Todays Dalits dont read hios books and simply parrot the AIT ‘… what about great learned todays ‘brahmins & other casts’ are they away with untouchbility…
if dalits mug-up AIT its not big deal they learnt a history fact wrongly..
But if great learned upper caste people still maintain untouchability.. they are real demons according to vedas..

‘that is why Gandhiji saw to it that he resigned from the fund set up to do away with untouchability’
If gandhiji honestly wanted to erase caste system he could have but he didn’t even after many others request.. He wanted birth-based caste system to exist..
If learned people like Gandhi (a god man) does that then it is very obvious that common humanitarians like me (who move away with situation) to burn vedas as arjun killed Bhishma to protect justice…
When Gandi gave new name to shudras as ‘Harijans’ foolish people rejoiced; indeed it is another disgrace.. Read Savarkar comments on Gandi’s attitude towards caste-system

Refer this from "Who were the Shudras":
"I am not sorry for this clash with Arya Samajists. The Arya Samajists have done great mischief in making the Hindu society a stationary society by preaching that the Vedas are eternal, without beginning, without end, and infallible, and that the social institutions of the Hindus being based on the Vedas are also eternal, without beginning, without end, infallible and therefore requiring no change. To be permeated with such a belief is the worst thing that can happen to a community. I am convinced that the Hindu society will not accept the necessity of reforming itself unless and until this Arya Samajists' ideology is completely destroyed. The book does render this service, if no other."

I do not want to question Ambedkar's sincerity to Dalit cause, but do feel that he got bit too biased against foundations of our culture.

@agniveerji

Tamil created doubt in me..
Are Veda and Upanishads separate??
I thought Vedas contain Karma Kanda + Jnana Kanda
Karma Kanda – just mantras, rituals etc..
Jnana – Upanishads and Philosophy

Please make it clear..

Thanks

@munmun : the point is that there is no such thing in the veda. even if brahmins did that , they were wrong, but that does not implicate the scripture in any way.

@munmunsarma
Why don’t you have 2ndlook at http://2ndlook.wordpress.com/
According to one of its articles it was British who made Brahmins vs lowcaste.
We have many shudras who became Brahmins and written epics like Ramayan,Mahabharata,etc.
Vishwamitra was Kshatriya became Maharshi(Brahmin) and his sons were Shudras.
1000 year rule by “Desert bloc” has manipulated our customs so much that we forgot that once upon a time we practiced absolute free speech.

Agniveer Sir,

1. Do you have any proof that the story of Mahabharat you read today is what actually happened 6000 years ago and there has been no changes in the text? SIR, EXCEPT BOOKS AND TEXT THERE IS NO PROOF IF ANY HISTORY THAT IS FALSE OR TRUE, YOU SEE GOD, UR FATHER SEE GOD, UR GRANDFATHER SEE GOD, NO BODY SEE THE GOD BUT EVERY BELIEVE GOD IS SOMETHING WITHOUT ANY PROOF. THERE IS ALSO NO PROOF ABOUT VEDA AND THERI ORIGINALITY AND PUREITY.

3. Can you cite a single mantra from Vedas that justify birth-based caste-system? SIR, HAVE ANY MANTRA IN VEDA WHO FINISH CORRUPTION, POORTY, ILLETRACY INEQUALITY FROM INDIA AND CAN WE GET BLACK MONEY FROM SWISS BANK THRU ANY MANTRA, IF VEDA SOLVE OUR PROBLEM THEN WE BELIEVE OTHERWISE BOTH ARE PROOFLESS.

5. Do you even know the meaning of Arya? SIR, MEANING OF ARYA IS NOT GREATER THAN THE MEANING OF HUMANITY, ALL HUMANBEING RESPECT THE HUMANITY THEN THERE IS NO NEED TO KNOW THE MENING OF ARYA.
6. Do you know meaning of Brahmin and do you know how it is defined in Vedas and Arya literature? SIR, VEDAS BRAHMIN MEANING YOU KNOW BUT HISTORY PROVES THAT WHO DIVIDE THE HUMANITY AND RULE IS CALLED BRAHAMIN, PLEASE SEE UR SORRUDING IN BHARAT.

We are not league of Jaichand or Ghori. SIR HAVE YOU ANY PROOF OF JAI CHAND AND GAURI , THIS SI ALSO A STORY IN BOOKS IN THE SHAPE OF TEXT LIKE RAMAMAYNA AND MAHABHARTA, THEN WHY ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT JAI CHAND AND GAURI, THIS IS NOT FARE, I THINK YOU WANT TO PROVE HATHI KE DANT KHANE KE AUR DIKHANE KE AUR.

Dalbir Sir,
1.UNESCO’s recognises Vedas as the oldest corpus of poetry, philosophy and myth transmitted orally generation by generation. Vedas were recited using a special method of recitation which is akin to modern error correction and detection codes. This feature has allowed it to be passed on from generation to generation for many millennia without the introduction of errors.
3. Yes, I would mention just one mantra, Satyamev Jayate. It means, Truth always triumphs. If people could affix this mantra completely in their minds then we would never face the problem of corruption.
5.Yes, I agree that the meaning of Arya is not greater than humanity but is certainly helpful for it. Arya means a noble person. If all of humanity could become Aryas(nobles) then the world would certainly be a better place.
6.Indian history certainly proves that the Britishers, Mughals did divide and rule, not Brahmins as they were not the ruling class. Kshatriyas were the ruling class.

Therefore, I think the case of Dalbir Singh itself proves that ATHI KE DANT KHANE KE AUR DIKHANE KE AUR.

Sir, A sub agency of UNESCO’s also publish three survey reports during the last 4-3 month regarding Human Capital, Social security and social service. In these reports our neighbour countries are far far better then Aryans and that countries are Bangla Desh, Bhutan, Pakistan, Nepal and Sri Lanka. Nobality cannot be seen and talking about nobal person. Developed countires do not know about VEDA and their mantra they are more honest and nobal then us why not we.
If people could affix this mantra completely in their minds then we would never face the problem of corruption Can you affix this mantra in the mind of Hindu or Aryana MLAs/MPs/Business community/Public dealing officials, never. No body cannot believe it. Vo vedo ko Dho rahe hai maan nhi rahe. Good things liked by everybody, if vedas are good then accept all hindus. But now a days only few people see here.
Indian history certainly proves that the Britishers, Mughals did divide and rule, not Brahmins as they were not the ruling class. Kshatriyas were the ruling class. You are 100% wrong if brahmins unit all then nobody have dare to attack on us, we are divided by Brahmins and resulting everyone attack of us. First four division in verna and after that thousands of division in castes. Verna and caste system available before the Mughals and Britisher everybody know.

Chanakya was brahmin while Chandra gupta was not,Amatya Rakshas was brahmin while Parmananda(evil king) was sudra.Why only Brahmins were protrayed as most wicked.If we look even on post vedic and pre buddhist we will see that they were most poor, was not allowed to own land, forbidden to do agricultue, can not ask gold or aspect favour from ruling class,and were just made to live on fruits and grains given by others.Only when people started thinking that education is better than warfare they gain respect.
Also Sadhus and Sanyasies were never brahmins.

SSS you are the biggest Jerk I have ever seen on one side you say you hate Brahmins and on other side you worship MAHABRAHMIN RAVANA (Ravana was called Mahabrahmin) you pakistani.

I think you who has forgotten the story of Mahabharata the prime minister of Hastinapur and Indraprastha was VIDUR who was a DASI PUTRA and LORD KRISHNA was from lower caste. So there is no Caste System in Mahabharata.

@VikramAditya
I liked your post indeed.. but
‘Bollywood, TV, internet etc. ‘ these are the biggest disgrace on India in my opinion. Because of these many Indians are busy in their self sensual enjoyments, without caring about neighbours sorrows..

I don’t want to get into illegal relationships and their effects..

Already india is devoid of purity of husband & wife relations. I fear that sooner mother’s love will be scarce in mother India as west..

कृषिगौरक्ष्यवाणिज्यं वैश्यकर्म स्वभावजम्।
परिचर्यात्मकं कर्म शूद्रस्यापि स्वभावजम्॥१८-४४॥
Agriculture, rearing of cows and honest
exchange of merchandise — these constitute the
natural duty of a Vaisya (a member of the trading
class); and service of the other classes is the
natural duty even of a sudra (a member of the
labouring class). (BG – 18.44)
.
loed krishna on duties of vaishya..[:)]

Pratap Brother I am not a fan of BR Ambedkar, Muslims have penchant to quote BR Ambedkar regarding Hindu Caste System so I am giving them their own medicine that Ambedkar himself has said that Muslim Caste System is worse than Hindu Caste System. Yes you are very correct communist historians are fifth column communities except in islamic countries these communist historians use tactics of disinformation in their Target country so that people feel inferior about their national identity and adopt communist identity.

http://users.smartgb.com/g/g.php?a=s&i=g18-18827-d4

Beef eating stoped in 19th century ????????????
must be jocking to light down the mood.
Even in Vedic a milking cow was agahan can not be killed only bulls and non milking cows were.
Vedas hailed people who were vegetarians, the sramanas and the atheist too.
Cow eating stoped even before buddha (Jinas have been credited) mostly because it prooved soooooo profitable live and also because Jinas.

@shabeer: Poor you just like your brethren who just blabber to feel good
here is the actual scripture. (by Krishnananda 🙂 )

http://www.dharmicscriptures.org/Chandogya_withEnglish%28Krishnananda%29.pdf

There is no such book as you mention and obviously p94 does not exist…except in Facebook. 🙂

@Aryavratasth
He might have picked the ‘chandalan’ and ‘shudra’ words from a well known verse in gita which says – a realized man will not differentiate between a learned pandit , a chandala, a dog and dog eater.
By supressing the sentence upto pandit , abrahamic religions are trying to portray that chandala=dog.

i specified here like (As quoted by Krishnananda Swami in ‘The Caste-Wars in India’, P.94)

not Chandogya_withEnglish%28Krishnananda%

read the following

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Varna_(Hinduism)

a first class reply my friend,this is the method to escape the truth.i think u r hindu,u have no of veda that i specified there,open it,read it i give the verses no.if not prove the exact veres here,that a morl way of answering……………………..i expecting the valid replay…..

“swadarma here means abiding in the self and doing our duty without atachment to results”

who claim it? can you give a authorised scripture about it?

“Infact many hindu text openly prescribe to reject everything”

that means some verses in the veda r created by somone is it? u agree?

@shabeer
>>who claim it? can you give a authorised scripture about it?
a person called ramana maharshi interpreted it – http://talks-with-ramana-maharshi.blogspot.com/2007/05/talk-58.html
authorization – hindu have no central structure to authorise, different people can differ without the guilt of going to hell.

>>that means some verses in the veda r created by somone is it? u agree?
No what i mean is knowledge of god is not got by reading books or repeating some verses from veda.
It should be gained by experiencing, and one of the popular way is to reject everything (neti) which is not you.

@Shabeer : Once you raised the same question, and I have answered you with word by word translation. What the hell are you ? You could not answer my replies. And after a long time you are pasting the same garbage. Are you really want truth ?? This attitude shows your nature. This proves, you are really worried of the truth, and you just cant dare to accept the truth.

@akhi
you never replay perfectly,my intention not about harasment of religion,i respect all religion,theit civilisation,cuture and veda.

but veda and upanishid cantain no of verses against the moralility,i pointed out here,to response my hindu friends.

@Shabeer,
>>but veda and upanishid cantain no of verses against the moralility

Morality is subjective and changes according to time/place. The basic moral rule is “Do unto others as you would have others do unto you”.
The meaning of the below verse of gita even goes further and ask to consider every living being as equal.

vidya-vinaya-sampanne
brahmane gavi hastini
suni caiva sva-pake ca
panditah sama-darsinah

So if you consider something as not accaptable in veda, reject that verse afterall god is the guide of all. hinduism is not a book based religion like islam or bible which condems every non believer to hell.

@Dalbir

Sir, You have explained many things about Hinduism. Please guide us what we (Hindu) should do now?

Sir, Now a days handsome and well qualified boys and girls available in each verna may be more or less. If an Hindu or Arya family come ahead and take initiative for inter verna or inter caste marriage from top verna to bottom verna and bottom verna to top verna. A brhamin married her daughter to Shudra verna and then a shudra verna married her daughter to Brahmin verna. Solve all problem and respect each other.

look>>>>>>>>>>>agniveer.com/forum/Thread-Islam-and-Child-Marriage
agniveer.com/forum/Thread-Islamic-Prophet-at-53-had-sex-with-9-year-old-baby>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

@shabeer
You are fool how dare you put blame Mohamad did sex with a child. But Mohamd never did sex with any child less than 16 years old. & Aisa was daughter of Mohamad. Mohamad was a divine personality and he was aware sex with less than 16 years is a sin. You want to denigrate Mohamad. You are Kaffir.

@Dalbir,

Sir, You are exposing Hinduism very well. Hindu are worst of people as per you. Please guide us what we should do now to be like you? I assume you are very noble person.

Dalbir Singh,

I have seen guys like you post, but you know what, I never once seen you guys give one solution. Okay, you listed some issues, which I disagree with, but let’s even say they are all 100% correct, what is your solution. I really want to hear it. All you guys ever do is post problems, but never one solution. I are you to STUPID to come up with a solution. Do you lack the brain power to come up with a good solution. Are you a RETARD.

Krishnarao

Krishanrao sir, Good monrning, Please now come to the point of solution, Solution of each and problem with Brahmins and Aryans because a nobel prson always believe in Karma system not birth. If a shudra become educated then he become Brahmin by Karma not by birthcan Aryan or brahmin married their daughter with a that person who is shudra by birth and Brahmin by KarmaTiil date I have never seen any case. Now come to the solution.

An aryana or brahmin first married their daughter to a shudra by birth and Brahmin by karma and first prefeence to poor educated and help financially for their upliftment. This system motivate all the shudras male for qcquiring education and each and every one be educated. and second he married his/her son with daughter of shudra by birth and brahmin by karma, i mean to say educated girls of shudra. This first generation feel differences between verna system after 2 or 3 generation all are become equal and then talk about eauality and reservation automatically finish. Then our Prime not begging technology and financial assistence for Bullet train to Japan.

@Dalbir,

__________—- If a shudra become educated then he become Brahmin by Karma not by birthcan Aryan or brahmin married their daughter with a that person who is shudra by birth and Brahmin by KarmaTiil date I have never seen any case._________________________

There are many case like this. My Boss is a Vaishya. He married to his daughter with Shudra by birth but a Brahimin by deeds. My brother is Vaishya by birth but he is Shudra by deed so we get him married with Shudra girl.

Varna System prevails in all society of the world. Saudi Arabian believe themselves Brahimin (Superior) so they not give their daughter to non-Arab Muslim because they believe them Shudra Muslim.

Krishna Rao sir, There are very few cases available in our society need to increase more and more, There are some other factors working here like less sex ratio of female, female is job. In north India vaish community have an evil of dowry, poor vaish families who have not fulfil vaish boy demand then married their daughter to shudra family. This is not a matter of Vaish and Shudra also Brahmin and Akshtrya by birth and karma also.

Saudi Arabian muslim never allow education to their daughters, and have plenty of money for their livelyhood, India also face the same stage when there is no right of education for women. If arabian muslim girls become educated then they also choose their life partner as per their convinent.

You are right Krishana Rao jee, Arabia muslims believes in by birth superior. When a shudra convert into cristian he beocme 100% father in a church, In sikhism he can become 100% Granthi in Gurudawara, If he convert into Budh he can become Monk. But a shudra never become Brahmin/Pandit after reading and follow veda, geeta ramayana etc.etc.so shameful for humanity. There are lot of tamples in India where only by birth brahmins are allow to enter even. Even in ISCON foreigners are adopt it and they are more dedicated , Honest, faithful and do better than Hindus/Brahmins for this organisation, but they are also treated inferior than Brahmin/Hindu the why Krishana Bhogwan not come for justice. There are y 100% reservation of by birth Brahmin without merit why they are crying for SC/ST/OBC reservation and talking about equality, HATHI KE DANT KHANE KE AUR DIKHANE KE AUR.

@Dalbir

Dear Dalbir, I have solution to your all problems if you really want to get rid from Varna or birth Caste system whatever you may call this. If all people of India convert into Islam they would become free from the clutches of caste system and social injustice. And it is very easy. You can do this by reciting “Shahada” and change your identity by changing your name into any preferable Arbian Name. In the past many people of Indian sub-continent did this. Today 25 Crore Muslim of India 20 Crores Muslim of Pakistan, Many crores people of Bangladesh and Afghanistan are free from the clutches of caste system and living life of self esteemed.

@Dalbir

Have you thought about my above suggestion? We can start from you.

Shuruat to kisi na kisi ko karni hi paregi, Ak chalega tabhi kafila banes ALLAH HU AKBAR

Agnivir Sir, You are free to have your opinion.
Who provide this freedom for opinion. Before entred Islam, Shuras have not free to have their opinion about baseless and inequal system of Hindusaim. For this very painful punishments are available in Manusamriti you can read and that was inplimented in all shudra and other verna. Even if a shudra has talent he has no right to shift in higher profession as per their will before 1833. After 1833 British Govt. provide this facility to shudra on merit basis and Sh. Mata Deen Bhagi and Father of Hon,ble Dr. B.R.Ambedakr joined Army. After 1833 no symtums of VEDAS were available in Hindusiam. In the Time of Krishana Eklavya become world’s Topmost DHANUSHDHARI what was the result each and every one knows. At that time what was doing VEDAs and their followers now a days who demanding equality. That was not on KARMA that was on BIRTH base abd merit base. Corruption and reservations started by Hindusiam and their GODs. This is not my views I read in Ramanaya, Geeta, Purans and Samrities.

You are abusing some Brahmins despite this article and there being no evidence that all Brahmins are your enemy. So you are full of hate and prejudice. How do you expect then that others will not show same behavior towards you that you are showing towards them?

Shudras are not begger, Brahamins are Beggers, Shudra demand for their rights being a human and that was Right o eucation without education man is like animal and they use Women and shudra like animal . Now shudra and women become educated and have knowledge more than brahmins this right provide British Govt. not VEDA or Brahmins, BRAHAMINS, AKSHTRIYA AND VAISH HAD ENJOYED RESERVATION THOUSANDS OF YEARS AND SHUDRA ENJOY THIS ONLY FEW YEAR COMPERATIVELY THAT IS NOT FULLY AT THIS TIME. CAN ANY VEDA OR VEDA FOLLOWER PROVIDE THIS FACILITY TO SHUDRA EQUAL TO YEARS THEY ENJOYED

THIS IS ALSO RIGHT OF EQUALITY.

You are correct Dalbir Singh ji. Caste system in India is based on birth and not on occupation [i.e. karam]. I have been saying that since long. Every caste is like an ethnic community or derived or claims to have roots from an ethnic community and every caste has its traditional history though said in mythical form [i.e. called ‘kula purana’]. This is the key to the longevity and almost indestructibility of the caste system. Also this caste system should have ante-dated the Aryan phase [whether Aryans were nomadic tribes from Middle East or indigenous etc. here not necessary] since the early vedic texts do not contain reference to the caste system and the purusha sukta in which shudras etc. are said to have born from the feet of that Purusha, etc. are of the later vedic times. It is like African tribes with their various and different cultural identities being assimilated in slave society under colonial masters and taking up Christianity but still hankering for their ‘roots’. Fortunately, unlike the Africans who were subjected to horrible genocides and almost obliteration of their culture, traditions, etc. here in Hindu society every caste has been allowed the freedom to work and operate in its own sphere, of course in a specific place in the hierarchy, but not totally extinguished [like the ‘Red Indians’ in North America or the natives in South America, ‘Bushmen’ in Australia, etc. etc.]. By this I am not denying that in phases of conquest the defeated tribes were not subjected to atrocities, massacres, etc. But the very philosophy or psyche inherent in Hindu society in general of shunning the ‘other castes’ and not ‘accepting and assimilating’ them has served as a boon to the identity and continued existence of these ethnic communities in different slots in the hierarchy. That is why you find many of the Western scholars and analysts in the late 19th and some even in early 20th century also lauding the durability, tenability etc. of caste system.

Sir, GOD, VEDAS, RAMA, RAMAYANA, GEETA, KRISHANA, PURANS, SAMRITIES ARE only for discussion, effect of thest have been seen only may be 1% in the sorrounding socities in all communities. We discuss here all good things requried for humanity but in the society totally opposite. Before 1833 there was no equality in any sephere and in any verna. British Govt. provide equality in 1833 after that shudra joined British Army. All superiors jobs are 100% reserved for upper three verna. At that time GOD VEDA RAMA RAMAYANA KRISHANA GEETA BECAME HANDICAPPED DEAF AND DUMB, who believe in VEDA why they become silent why they not takling about equality. Shudra was always explointed were hindu population in majority. In the present days maximum shudra exploitation cases from UP, Bihar, MP states.